#105: Expert Insights on Biophysics and the Future of Drug Discovery: An Interview with Dr. Thomas Schubert of 2bind

Are you ready for the grand finale of our Year in Review Recording? 

The final episode of 2022 is here, and it's one for the books! We've explored the cutting-edge innovations and technologies shaping the future of the biotech industry with some of the most brilliant minds in the field. From Kurt Höller of EIT Health, to Albert Missbichler from Fianostics, Caroline Heil from the new meat company, Mauricio Agudelo and Lina Toro from Bialtec, Kimberly Cornfield from the UCL, Collin Ewald from ETH Zurich, and Guido Gualdoni from G.ST Antiviral, we've had some truly enlightening conversations. 

But we saved the best for last! 

Get ready for an exclusive interview with Dr. Thomas Schubert, CEO of 2bind, a provider of biophysical outsourcing solutions that is revolutionizing the way we study molecular interactions and protein stability. Don't miss out on this one-of-a-kind episode. 

Tune in now!

 This cutting-edge biotech company is revolutionizing how we study molecular interactions and protein stability. They're doing it with a track record of over 1400 successfully completed tasks in research projects with over 350 customers in the last 11 years.

In this episode, you'll get an inside look at the driving force behind 2bind and the expert knowledge that sets them apart in the biophysics field. From breakthrough moments to industry trends, you'll gain a deeper understanding of the future of biotech and the role that companies like 2bind will play in shaping it.

But that's not all! You'll also hear from Dr. Schubert about the company's partnerships with leading device producers and how they navigate the digital world to stay ahead of the curve. Plus, you'll get insight into the supply chain challenges that 2bind faced in the last years and how they overcame them.

Don't miss out on this opportunity to learn from the best in the business! Tune in to our latest podcast episode and join the conversation on the future of biotech.

Trust us; this episode is a must-listen for anyone in the biotech industry or anyone passionate about innovation and the future of medicine. It's packed with valuable insights and information you won't miss.

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Thomas Schubert
Christian Soschner

⏰  Timestamps:
00:00) Introduction
(02:00) Unveiling the mastermind behind 2bind, Dr. Thomas Schubert 
(04:05) Insider tips for starting your own biotech company
(07:36) A glimpse into the future: 2022 for 2bind's CEO 
(10:40) Navigating the digital world: Pros and cons of technology in biotech 
(14:16) Overcoming obstacles: A look at 2bind's supply chain challenges 
(18:21) Game-changing developments in biophysics for 2022 
(19:53) What's next for the industry? A preview of biophysics trends to come 
(23:19) Peeking into the crystal ball: 2bind's plans for 2023 
(24:25) Mark your calendars: Upcoming conferences featuring 2bind in 2023 
(30:49) Bold predictions for the biotech industry in 2023 
(32:33) Addressing the challenges: How to improve drug discove

Transcript

so here it is the final episode of the

0:06

year in review recording 20 22. the year has come to an end on

0:15

December 31 in the western world and also China had its New Year's Event

0:23

last weekend and so also is our year in review recording coming to its

0:29

traditional land but not without one final epic episode in the previous

0:37

episodes we have explored the cutting-edge Innovations and Technologies shaping the future of the

0:45

Biotech Industry with some of the most Brilliant Minds in the field from

0:51

quartella of AET Health to Albert misbecker from fionnostics Carolina from

0:59

the new Meat Company Mauricio agudelo and Lena Toro from beer Tech Kimberly

1:05

cornfield from the UCL call enabled from

1:11

worked only from TSD antiviral we have had some truly enlightening

1:17

conversations but we saved the best for last I am thrilled to bring you again Dr

1:24

Thomas Schubert CEO at two band a provider of biophysically Outsourcing

1:30

solutions for the drug Discovery and biologics Fields to bind has a track record of over 1 400

1:39

successfully completed tasks in research projects with over 350 customers in the

1:47

last 11 years learn how they are revolutionizing the way we study

1:52

molecular interactions protein stability and much much more so don't miss out

1:58

this episode it's the last one of the young review recording and you wouldn't

Unveiling the mastermind behind 2bind, Dr. Thomas Schubert

2:03

want to miss it join me as we dive into the world of biophysics with two band

2:12

Thomas good to see you hello hi folks they're coming now from antiviral

2:19

infections to the world of biophysics maybe you say some some words to

2:25

introduce you to Guido yeah so first of all Guido I also have kids and I can just completely share the point about

2:31

the respiratory diseases in the moment it's crazy kindergarten so also from my

2:36

side please speak there's a need I will I will it's really

2:41

annoying so everything is in the kindergarten it's crazy yeah um my name is Thomas I'm a managing

2:49

director at two mind we are a company in close to Munich in Regensburg and we're

2:56

biophysics folks um so we are offering Outsourcing solutions for drug Discovery

3:01

and Drug development and basically Supply people with um yeah an analysis

3:07

formats and Essay formats um so uh that's that's who I am and uh I I was

3:14

really amused and it was very nice to listen to you Guido about your approach

3:19

and uh yeah crossing fingers for for every new thing that you are going to develop really cool thank you Thomas

3:27

it's very nice to hear I'm very curious to learn what you guys are doing sure

3:32

perfect um yeah uh I think uh first of all

3:38

Christian thanks for the opportunity welcome uh it's really a pleasure I mean

3:43

uh our last discussion is I think like four or three weeks ago I guess so it's

3:48

nice to be back and and have this um yeah it's it's Pleasant to be here again really cool it's it's good it's

3:56

good to see you again I have a question to you too we were talking about entrepreneurship today and I have two

4:02

entrepreneurs now in the car um the same question to both of you so when

Insider tips for starting your own biotech company

4:09

a person is scientist approaches you and asks you for advice from your experience

4:17

um what's the single most important advice you would give to a scientist who would like to found a company

4:26

no I have to go first you have to go first okay I also have to think about it but

4:33

um I think um foreign good ideas there are several good ideas

4:39

out there um but sometimes um the business model is not clear

4:44

um I think scientists don't consider that um bringing an idea to Market really needs

4:51

more than an idea and there are Financial aspects behind and you have to have a proper team you have to have the

4:57

environment to do so and sometimes a good scientific idea is uh honestly not

5:03

good enough so surround yourself with um well known people from from the field

5:10

and discuss with them I think that is a very important advice that I could give

5:16

even though I'm you know our business uh is uh is maybe more easy because it's a

5:22

service fee for service business model that we have but for example um with a classical drug Discovery approach I

5:28

would definitely first of all talk to a lot of people um before I do anything an idea is not not enough

5:36

I mean I definitely couldn't agree more Thomas I think you know while you were starting out I thought is that about

5:42

pretty much the same that and I think um Christian we talked about it last week as well that you know sometimes when you

5:49

start out with a company or a spin-off or you you want to start something of your own you think that the idea is kind

5:55

of the big part of what you're going to be doing right but the very very big

6:01

part is actually like the larger part the larger fraction um is actually ahead of you of you still

6:08

right and it's um something that is heavily underestimated um but

6:14

I I I think I also want to want to finish with what we talked about beforehand be aware of your optimism

6:21

bias talk to people in the field and talk to people in the field try to get

6:26

some you know objective resonance from what you're planning to be doing

6:31

um and uh and yeah I think talking talking talking makes a lot of sense you need to be very I think the singer

6:38

singer most important characteristic of an entrepreneur is to be proactive

6:45

um and this is what you need to be doing right proactively talk to people go out

6:50

there shape your idea and be aware that it's going to be a very

6:55

too long long and but probably hopefully a very um also a fruitful path

7:04

it's not entrepreneurship it's not the way to quit money playing the lottery is much faster

7:11

last week I had Chivan from play fair capital and she also emphasized product

7:17

Market fit so I couldn't agreement so what you say thank you very much for your time I wish

7:23

you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year and let's catch up in the new year and maybe we do a podcast episodes

7:29

together about your company it was great talking you might all the best merry

7:34

merry Christmas and happy New Year to both of you as well have a great time

A glimpse into the future: 2022 for 2bind's CEO

7:39

Thomas it's good to see you again absolutely because yeah how was your

7:45

2022 uh how was my 2022 I'm good I think overall

7:50

um so I'm really happy uh it was a challenging year um for us as company

7:56

um as to bind um indeed it was challenging uh there were challenges

8:01

starting with a Ward and covet lockdown and um you know inflation recession combined

8:08

all those things but um still I'm very proud about the team here at turbine um

8:14

even under these challenging conditions we made a brilliant job very happy um yeah good good year

8:22

what's excited you the most in 2022 what excited me the most um first of all

8:29

I mean honestly on a trivial level uh it was very exciting to go out again and

8:35

meet people that was also a little bit the the thing that we had in our podcast if you had some weeks ago it was really

8:42

I'm still excited about this it's really a pleasure to meet people again

8:48

uh all good also like now having this podcast together in the Stream format

8:54

it's great but um you know having really some some person in front of you and

9:00

really having a good chat uh this is something I really missed and I was very excited to have that back and of course

9:07

um yeah this excited me personally best exciting as I mentioned I was really excited about how things went here um at

9:15

the company and how we developed this was exciting for me too and um yeah I

9:21

think that's it yeah I couldn't agreement when I think uh last year and the year before it was mostly sitting at

9:28

home because everything everything was shut down and closed and now I can go to

9:34

a restaurant around the corner uh invite some people have a lunch have dinner or

9:40

just going to the gym meeting people or also conferences we met at the bio

9:46

Europe in Leipzig it's so awesome to have that back absolutely I miss this a

9:52

lot it's also on a personal level really I missed the connection to a lot of like

9:58

um friends in the business realm that I really missed and um of course you can write and you of course you can even you

10:04

can even have a digital beer together but the real beer is is the better way I don't know digital beer um it's uh yeah

10:12

yeah exactly that's yeah but you know having a real line over here that's much

10:17

better I mean I think um for me it's I think it's a good balance to have some

10:23

conversations uh digitally like recording video podcasts um it would be

10:29

very very challenging to fly all people in and uh to exchange information but uh

10:35

once in a while meeting in person I think it's it's necessary business doesn't flourish without that

Navigating the digital world: Pros and cons of technology in biotech

10:41

I can absolutely agree to that it's like it has to be a good mix yeah because what what I can't replicate with the

10:48

digital world the digital world is great when I know people are ready so reaching out to people I know and uh inviting

10:54

them to a podcast as possible um we met basically the accident uh

10:59

Sarah typically this was a pure chance that we didn't agree to meet in Leipzig

11:04

yeah we just pumped into each other yeah that's true and this this doesn't happen I never found a way to replicate that in

11:11

the digital world did you find a way to do that no um I mean there were some

11:18

approaches also to to have this kind of digital meetings in and at conferences

11:23

but I had the impression that this is not really uh leading to the right direction it's it's because people sit

11:31

at home and the daily work is ongoing and so it's just another you know date in in the time slot where you have a

11:38

meeting and there's not not you know when we met at Leipzig it was like prompting it into each other as we as

11:44

you just described it was because both of us were there and we were interested in learning about new people and not

11:51

about specific topic but just like who are you what are you doing and this format is I think that this is difficult

11:58

to find a this informal just being friendly hey how how are you doing uh in

12:04

in a digital world I'm not sure if this is possible I don't know but

12:11

I haven't found a way the metaverse has I mean um the technology already existed 20

12:18

years ago so it's basically nothing different than what people used in multi-massive online role-playing games

12:24

it's uh fun it's entertaining but it's still not the same so still this

12:30

community also thrived on meeting in real life and when I go through the last

12:37

20 years when I was in business I think most of the business evolved really from real life meetings that we are not

12:43

really planned at conferences or even events or lunch events and the minority evolved from set up

12:50

meetings through conference systems yeah I I think for for from for us at

12:57

least because we have a clear uh uh profile of what we can do and people can

13:02

can read up on that and it's it's clear that people come to us for outsourcing Solutions and biophysics there's no

13:09

misinterpretation possible so some of those those those meetings and when you lock them in a meeting conference

13:17

um or account this can be very efficient but I fully agree um the best

13:24

um let's say long-term relationships came from a situation uh which is

13:30

different from that um on a meeting but evening event or yeah it just met and uh Had a Good

13:39

Chemistry Between each other and um then there's some interest in each other and you learn and you like each other and

13:45

then suddenly it happens that you work together so I fully agree here both aspects but both possible and important

13:53

the the thing is with innovation in my opinion so with companies most of the companies I work with are trying to

13:59

start something new and uh sometimes when people start something new

14:05

um it's not really clear what they need and which help the needs because it's inability it's a new idea so the plan

14:12

has to be made yet and uh very often people are the first time doing this

Overcoming obstacles: A look at 2bind's supply chain challenges

14:17

thing and most entrepreneurs in deep deck are first timers because it's a very novel idea it's a noble technology

14:24

so what I found very helpful is uh meeting random people at events uh to

14:31

just be creative together and you can do that in five minutes or by coffee this

14:37

is what I'm doing this is what I'm looking for and then the person says okay I know this guy or I I it's a

14:43

similar thing in that way maybe you talk to this guy and I never found this happened really in the digital world

14:49

yeah yeah I fully agree this is this is a spirit of just you know like having

14:56

a close idea and um yeah bringing this to some point um this is difficult in in

15:01

a digital world in my eyes yeah when we talk about the big lessons besides

15:07

digital worlds and uh real-life worlds what was your biggest lesson of 2022

15:12

that you learned um I think there were two lessons uh one

15:18

lesson is a lesson on a let's say a learning from a negative situation and

15:24

the other one is from a positive situation and the the negative situation is that um you you mentioned it just in a

15:32

second uh at the beginning of the discussion in a in a small sentence is Supply chains so we really learned the

15:39

lesson that Supply chains are difficult in a globalized world um and specifically in an instable

15:46

political situations um Supply chains are extremely important and um you know our customers they they

15:54

uh drug Discovery guys that work with molecules from all around the globe and

16:00

and they send it to us to to to Regan's work to our laboratory and we analyze

16:05

these things so the samples come from different areas and so we had a lot of

16:10

molecules coming from close to Kiev from a large supply of chemical matter in our mind they had to temporarily shut down

16:17

because of the war so it was really taken a lot of uh you know effort

16:23

to solve that in the same moment few months later there was the Shanghai lockdown and every protein that that was

16:29

produced in Shanghai was stuck there so it was really a lesson what I I mean

16:35

it's not my personal level because it's a decision of of the customer where to purchase these things but my lesson is

16:42

um that um short supply chains and and accurate Supply chains

16:48

um that you you should prefer that and not go only for other

16:54

um yeah factors to decide why you choose this or that supplier this was a lesson

16:59

that was hard for us because of course we would depend on these things and obviously we need to organize ourselves

17:06

according to when samples arrive at our Laboratories then we can start out our

17:11

job and if the sample doesn't arrive then we cannot do our job so it was a lesson that I learned and um yeah

17:20

a good lesson was on the other hand side that um just like two weeks ago

17:26

um we we had a internal um customer survey so we sent out a

17:31

survey to our customers and um first of all um from 70 customers that we approached

17:38

uh more than 40 answered which is already a great success and then what they told us was extremely positive and

17:45

the lesson what I learned from that is that we are at most of the points that we are wanted to you know addressed in

17:53

the last years we're on the right track so there's a good lesson so I'm really happy about this so these two kind of

17:58

lessons I think I learned from from this year that's great that's great to hear

18:03

that your customers love what you do things you're always good to hear that you know and so for us it's only an

18:09

internal thing we share that with the laboratory and with the with the staff because uh this is for our internal

18:15

revenue or you know recapitulation of what we do and um so the feedback was

Game-changing developments in biophysics for 2022

18:21

extraordinarily good and so um I think there's we do something good I guess yeah this was cool when we think

18:29

it's of the world of biophysics what were breakthrough moments in biophysics

18:35

in 2022 um um I I think application of biophysics I

18:43

would say break breakthrough moments for applications and biophysics I think that's maybe the better wording

18:49

biophysics itself of course it also changes there are new technologies coming out and indeed um very

18:56

interesting ones but I think um the importance of biophysics um in uh 2022

19:03

was even more pronounced or more let's say valued

19:08

um the reason is because first of all a lot of different approaches now need a direct binding

19:14

determination drug Discovery antibody development and so on and so on and it turns out that this is extremely

19:20

important and um I think that is definitely a breakthrough and that the biophysics 10

19:27

years ago it was more a side life science part and now it's getting more into the center of drug Discovery

19:34

projects and getting more and more important um of course to be fair it's not just

19:39

2020 effort it's already started before so it is a constant increase of

19:44

biophysics need it's not just the 2020 year that made all that but I think it

19:50

turns out that this is more and more important and I call this a breakthrough let's let's go through yeah I also was

What's next for the industry? A preview of biophysics trends to come

19:56

amazed at the biophysics podcast has a very good reception so I saw it on uh on LinkedIn that many people liked it and

20:03

then listen to that um it seems to be more and more interesting the industry around this

20:09

topic which was uh which was very great to see um when we talk about the future Trends

20:15

now about biophysics uh where do you see this area heading to and first of all um

20:23

that the throughput will increase so throughput means that you can run more

20:28

samples in a shorter time and um by doing that you can of course achieve more and achieve more in terms of you

20:35

can screen large libraries or you can make more detailed analysis and this

20:41

means it will get more share on on the complete analysis Market let's call it and um here there is definitely a Trends

20:49

going to higher throughput and even throughput that could match up with some of the biochemical essays where

20:54

enzymatic activities are read out so this is something that definitely is something that is coming there's a trend

21:01

and the other trend is to also use biophysics in more um yeah difficult environments so far

21:08

biophysics has been done always in the in a context of in vitro uh artificial

21:13

buffer systems where a completely random buffer is chosen nothing to do with the

21:18

cell and um the trend goes towards more let's say close to Native analysis or

21:25

even analysis on on whole cells so there's for example the creoptic system

21:30

that comes out or is just came out five days ago officially launched

21:36

um uh which is now uh the Helix cycle it's called which can analyze kinetics

21:41

on a cell which is amazing so you can read out an antibody binding to a cell and this is just mind-blowing the

21:49

opportunities that now opens up so this is really cool too therefore there are these kind of Trends

21:56

in biophysics indeed what it is uh breakthroughs come from why didn't we see that what was the

22:04

change in technology that was necessary to generate this breakthrough um

22:11

because of a growing need over the years more money went into that area and then

22:17

I have to also say that in the last let's say 10 12 years quite a number of very Innovative new companies have been

22:25

brought up um like Nano tamper queer Optics uh DBS

22:30

and and others which are really uh like Innovative per se and they now benefit

22:36

from from having uh you know this this settled by physics Community but now

22:43

growing with new technologies and I think that's where the Innovation come from very good people together with a

22:50

growing need so you said uh as the first sentence first there's more money flowing into

22:55

this area um so money seems really to be the fuel necessary to to uh to bring technology

23:03

to fruition yeah every the need of course I mean if there's a certain need and you and and

23:09

if a good scientist um has a sense of Entrepreneurship as well yeah that's

23:15

also needed uh and and there's a potential situation where also money can be earned and then I I think that's also

Peeking into the crystal ball: 2bind's plans for 2023

23:22

part of the fuel yes not not purely money but um part of the fuel is also

23:27

money of course sure what are your plans for 2023 with your company

23:34

we have actually uh indeed a big plan so um we will move to a larger lab space or

23:41

at least we start to to restructure our laboratory we will get a new lab space with more than a thousand square meters

23:47

and this is of course quite a big part of what we do next year at least on my end because obviously this has to be

23:53

coordinated and uh yeah building up a lab is is not easy but it's a great

23:59

achievement and we're really looking forward to that and um then of course it's also getting more people in there

24:05

and there are also some ideas to bring in more um yeah Technologies in here um to be able to support our customers

24:12

even in a better way by having more than that that than the other 11 technologies

24:17

that we have in the moment so that's the plan for next year and and also the plan is to visit more

Mark your calendars: Upcoming conferences featuring 2bind in 2023

24:25

people and enjoy the conversation that's a that's a very good plan which conferences do you have from your

24:31

program and so the buyers I I will definitely go to the buy convention um it's in Boston I will do some medcam

24:38

approaches the Festival of biologic uh conference is the Festival of biologics

24:44

and Basel um we'll be there um I'm at the bio Korea I'm not sure about the bio Japan this

24:51

year next year I'm not not fixed on that um so until I think it's seven six or

24:57

seven conferences I I can do I have to admit I I also need to take a little bit

25:02

care about the family but uh yeah I think uh this is

25:10

definitely um something that I'm excited about next year anything body parts do you

25:16

mentioned bio career what's so special at the Korean ecosystem that's right yeah for your company absolutely good

25:22

question because um the Koreans start to build up quite intense and and and

25:29

um yeah versatile or let's say Lively biotech community so um they really

25:35

um now push push companies by very interesting let's say uh concepts of how

25:41

they can build up their business and career and of course there's money starting to go go in there and also larger companies

25:48

are now settling there and so there's a new ecosystem um being developed and um of course it's

25:56

a good approach to be there early on and um yeah to to be present so we have

26:02

already some very um good connections to Korea and a very successful work with those guys and it's

26:09

a good opportunity to go there to visit them first place and then of course buy a career itself it's a good opportunity

26:15

to present ourselves to the um yeah new environment that is growing

26:21

there North Korea is a lovely country the last time I was there I think was in 2017 so

26:26

it's a couple of years ago uh what the grades would be great to to fly there

26:31

um you mentioned before your um supply chain problems I had this a couple of times in this recording

26:39

session um was it really that's the challenging uh price wise and Logistics wise

26:47

um I mean I think you have to differentiate between two different kind of Supply chains the supply chain for

26:54

our consumables in our material that we need for our analysis internally we had on a good control so here

27:01

a few plastic where uh stuff was was a little bit troubling troubling to get

27:07

um this was not a big challenge I would say but this is also due to the fact that most of our suppliers are from

27:14

Europe um specifically from Germany so and they are quite reliable so here from this

27:20

perspective it was not a big challenge but as I mentioned so our customers which are drug developer which you know

27:27

solves their molecules which we do we don't produce molecules we don't we neither produce proteins nor we do

27:34

produce any chemical matter we don't do that so people need to send us these

27:39

things and they purchase this in different countries and obviously then

27:45

there was the the Suez Canal thing then there was the Shanghai lockdown then there was the start of the Ukraine war

27:52

and all those things come together and then suddenly a situation emerges that nobody can tell you when samples arrive

27:59

and here um minimum I would say five to eight to five to even ten boxes of with

28:05

dry ice full of molecules arrive every day and so the logistics team had no

28:10

idea where things are or at least tried to get figured out but nobody could tell

28:15

them the package is here and you have to do that because there was chaos so

28:22

um this was troubling so it is modeled supply chain of bringing together the material that we need to analyze so this

28:30

this was the trouble not the internal resources so principally

28:35

unpredictability of the supply chain so not knowing when when what will when

28:41

arrive in both States and Weeks Later months later exactly and of course by

28:48

biological material is not super stable so you need to refill dry ice you never know how does the sample arrive here is

28:55

it still in good shape you don't even know if there was at some point maybe no dry ice in there anymore and it was just

29:02

added nobody tells you so this is difficult and if uh you know uh really

29:08

like the the high quality packages which uh have a temperature

29:14

logger in there they are simply very expensive a lot of people send this by other means and there is no control of

29:21

what's in there so you don't know what how the temperature changed and you don't know how the biologics react on

29:27

that and so this was a bit challenging and I have to admit um so for for for us

29:32

for the customer of course because um they end the same boat as we are so we would love to start they would love

29:39

us to start but nobody could start because the things are not here so I was yeah a bit a bit annoying I have to say

29:46

but we found uh very good solutions for that and um the team did an incredible

29:51

job and the the result and the present that the customer gave us was was this

29:57

incredible survey at the end of the year so everybody's happy which is a good sign

30:02

but it was challenging do you see did the supply chains are going back to normal or are there still some

30:08

challenges left and there are still some challenges left but everything goes better now

30:14

um it seems to be more predictable so as you mentioned the unpredictability was

30:20

the main problem because you never know what happened and now things are getting more ordered and more in a clear way and

30:28

I mean everybody can you know agree that a package is sent to you maybe a week

30:33

later if the package a week later will arrive so then it's fine but if it

30:39

doesn't arrive a week later and maybe also two weeks later not or even three weeks later not if this is the problem problem so

30:46

um yeah no everything is now getting uh back to normal I would say at least is

Bold predictions for the biotech industry in 2023

30:52

that this is what we see Thomas I'm coming to the end of this recording session from uh about uh 12

30:58

p.m this afternoon to now and I can ask the final question now to you uh your

31:05

big prediction for 2023 what will happen in 2023 what will happen in 2023 uh who

31:12

open big question at the end so first of all from a perspective of

31:18

Bio physics and bio technology and so it is I think overall one can say that I we

31:24

think that the investment landscape will change a little bit um I think uh there might be overall

31:30

less money in the market for us as a company as a zero as a provider for analytical Services I doubt that this

31:36

will really harm us because people when the bill probably still do a lot of Outsourcing even more pronounced so I

31:43

think that will happen um uh but uh of course my hope is of

31:48

course that people try to or should try to listen also to the silent voices uh

31:55

not only the the loud and strong voices are that one that you should be listened because sometimes these strong voices

32:02

don't have very uh or maybe they have very weak ideas so I hope that this will

32:07

happen that people listen more to also science courses so yeah I I hope for

32:13

that but it's a hope I don't know if it happens I couldn't agree more just because

32:18

somebody is loud and outspoken doesn't mean that he or she is right correct

32:25

that's the essence of all that's I think a great great final word for uh today's

32:31

recording session Thomas it's always a pleasure speaking to you you bring such a great spirits to every conversation

Addressing the challenges: How to improve drug discovery and development in 2023.

32:37

and I'm pretty sure that you are one of the big success factors in your company

32:44

thank you so much I just can't give back the the one words it's always a pleasure

32:50

to talk to you and to have this conversation in this meeting format uh it's it's really great experience thanks

32:56

a lot for having me thank you very much thanks for joining I wish you your team and your family Merry Christmas and a

33:03

Happy New Year thank you likewise I wish you all the best thank you see you soon bye bye

33:10

thanks for tuning into this episode I hope you enjoyed it and learned

33:16

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33:22

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