#111: Colin McCann Reveals Game-Changing Vaccine Strategies at IVI

Are you tired of seeing the world struggle with global health crises? It's a harsh reality that many vaccine-preventable diseases continue to devastate vulnerable populations. But there's hope on the horizon!

In this eye-opening episode, we dive deep into a conversation with Colin McCann, a key player at the International Vaccine Institute (IVI), who shares incredible insights into their innovative approach to combatting these health challenges. You'll discover the groundbreaking strategies and collaborative efforts reshaping how we develop and deliver life-saving vaccines to those who need them most.

Don't miss out on this unique opportunity to learn about the future of global health and how the IVI is making a real difference. Click now to watch the full episode and get inspired!

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Christian Soschner:
Colin McCann

📖 Memorable Quotes:

(29:30) "IVI's role is to pick up challenges that the pharma industry would turn down, starting with comprehensive disease burden studies and surveillance to determine the true burden of neglected diseases."
(40:02) "There's the great problem of the translational graveyard - we have lots of wonderful vaccine candidates sitting on shelves around the world collecting dust, instead of saving lives."
(41:47) "European developers should realize that they could manufacture their vaccines in Africa, Latin America, or Asia and maintain profitability in doing so."
(55:51) "Countries that are often in tension with each other are able to cooperate on vaccine development."
(01:01:46) "By linking low & middle income countries together, they can train each other and build upon each other's abilities."
(01:18:44) "IVI's proven model: developing a vaccine from evidence through licensure & delivery, takes a comprehensive approach."


⏰ Timestamps:
(02:28) Vienna: The Hub for IVI's European Expansion
(07:55) The Unconventional Path to Joining the International Vaccine Institute
(11:09) Colin's journey: From wind turbine engineer to IVI member
(17:51) Bridging the gaps in vaccine development and scaling
(21:47) IVI's role in growing South Korea's biotech sector
(28:31) IVI's Role in Addressing Unmet Vaccine Needs
(35:56) Exploring IVI's Role in Clinical Development and Vaccine Manufacturing
(38:31) Facilitating Industry Partnerships and Filling Global Health Gaps
(42:42) Attracting Private Investors and Venture Capital in Vaccine Development
(45:50) The Role of CEPI in Addressing the Funding Gap for Vaccine Development
(49:35) ASEAN: Coordinating Vaccine Development and Streamlining Regulations
(54:58) Vaccine Diplomacy and Capacity Building in Africa
(57:00) Strengthening Healthcare Systems through Training
(01:00:10) South-South Triangular Cooperation for Capacity Building
(01:05:17) Combating Mosquito-Borne Diseases in Latin America
(01:10:51) Tackling Complex Zoonotic Diseases: A Holistic Approach
(01:14:49) Ensuring Sustainability: Empowering Local Communities
(01:19:30) Overcoming Policy Tunnel Vision: A Comprehensive Vaccine Lifecycle Approach
(01:22:36) Holistic Long-Term Decision Making in Global Health
(01:24:44) Government Collaboration in Tackling Global Health Challenges
(01:31:46) IVI's Expansion to Austria: Enhancing Research Cooperation
(1:34:50) Impactful Partnerships in Global Health
(1:36:18) Innovations: Encapsulation, Vaccine Patches, a

Transcript

are you seeking insights into the future of vaccines and Global health

0:05

then join me for a companion conversation with an industry expert uh

0:11

and our mission is to discover develop and deliver a safe affordable and

0:17

infectious vaccines in this episode of The Beginner's mind podcast I welcome

0:22

Colleen McCann from the international vaccine Institute together we delve into

0:28

vaccine accessibility cutting-edge Technologies and the power of

0:33

collaboration in shaping Global Health it's a woman situation if we are able to

0:39

develop the capacity for one country to manufacture vaccines and another to

0:45

in today's episode we cover topics like uncovering the significance of vaccine

0:52

accessibility and distribution in Emerging Markets exploring the potential

0:58

of mRNA vaccines and other groundbreaking Technologies

1:04

gaining insights into how Partnerships between countries and organizations can

1:10

drive Global Health advancements there is a system in place the ivi approach for example of developing a vaccine from

1:18

evidence through licensure and delivery it's it's there it works it's a it's a proven model enjoy the show and be sure

1:25

to subscribe to the channel for more thought-provoking conversations well

1:30

welcome everybody who's live I'm happy to answer any questions later in the podcast

1:35

so I hope the live stream works let me just check yeah now it's on LinkedIn this is always

1:43

a great thing to see I think I had one live stream where I forgot what I learned with LinkedIn for the technical part is that I have to renew on the live

1:52

streaming platform the token every four to six weeks and one time I forgot it

1:58

and unfortunately the live stream was not live streamed and you didn't know until afterwards

2:03

yeah I believe we learn I guess that's right that's the challenges of

2:09

Technology Pauline how is how is your time been in Vienna since we last met at our

2:15

delicious dinner at galleries yeah I gotta say that was one of the the best sticks I've had in a long time so I

2:22

really appreciated that dinner um you know we've been pretty busy actually the the day of our our dinner

2:28

uh Austrian Parliament uh approved the seat agreement which grants uh ivi it's

2:35

International Organization status here in Austria um I wasn't aware of that fact during

2:40

the dinner I didn't there wasn't a press release until the next morning um but in preparation for that uh the

2:48

last couple I guess the last week or so has been busy doing all the logistical and bureaucratic arrangements for that

2:55

filing paperwork and making contacts um one good note is our Board of

3:01

Trustees uh sort of governance Council for ivi is coming to Austria in the

3:07

beginning of May and they'll be having their um annual get-together here and

3:13

we'll be interfacing with uh quite a number of government officials the foreign Ministry the health Ministry the

3:20

science Ministry and engaging with the some of the local biotech firms as well

3:25

on the sidelines that's great that's great how many people will be in Vienna uh I think I saw between 25 and 30

3:34

people are coming yeah that's great now Brian is a great place to meet internationally yeah yeah we're looking

3:39

forward to it maybe we give a little bit background to what you do at the

3:44

beginning so to frame the episode so that people know what we are talking about um

3:50

I mean I have to say before I saw you on the uh on LinkedIn popping up I think it

3:55

was a post from Lisa Vienna if I remember it right to AWS I was not aware

4:00

about IBI is can you please give a little bit of information on ivi for the

4:06

listeners and a bit of information on your personal background sure um so I'll start with kind of a a

4:13

basic summary of what ivi is ivi is an international organization uh

4:19

it was established at the United Nations development program through a treaty

4:24

called The Establishment agreement of the international vaccine Institute that

4:29

treaty has been signed by 39 countries and the World Health Organization part

4:35

of my job is to get more countries to sign on to that treaty and to build the organization uh and our mission is to

4:43

discover develop and deliver safe affordable and infectious vaccines for

4:49

use in global Public Health and that's specifically vaccines for diseases that

4:55

have endemic burden and low and middle income countries uh for which there are little to no incentives uh in the

5:03

pharmaceutical industry in the market to develop those vaccines uh so we work across the vaccine

5:09

development Spectrum to advance the development of those vaccines and I can get into that process a little more

5:15

later our headquarters is in Seoul South Korea and we've been located there since

5:22

1997 and I can get into why we ended up there and and how we have around 230 240

5:30

staff primarily at our headquarters in Seoul but now working across Asia Africa and

5:37

Latin America we have our new European regional office based in Stockholm Sweden and this new

5:43

ivi country office located in Vienna Austria we also have three collaborating centers

5:49

in Africa and Ghana and Ethiopia and Madagascar and those sites help us Advance vaccine

5:57

r d programs in country um what is your personal background how

6:02

did you uh get involved into IBI sure it's it's a long roundabout story

6:08

which I'll save the most of it but you know yeah we have a lot of time today

6:13

sure so I'm I'm 39 years old and the last 20 years

6:19

uh I've been traveling the world uh I'm from the United States uh the Midwest a

6:26

city called Cincinnati Ohio in the state of Ohio and uh it's a nice place but

6:33

somewhat insular and I had the itch to get out and see the world so from the age of 19 I I started traveling the

6:39

world and seeing the world and since then I've been working and studying overseas for the greater part of 20

6:46

years um I graduated from University in 2008

6:51

uh in the U.S in the midst of the global recession I couldn't find a job and like

6:57

many Americans I had a lot of student loans I had to pay back for the college

7:02

program and I only found three jobs available uh there was a job in Costa

7:07

Rica in Algeria or South Korea and uh I took South Korea as a teaching job

7:14

uh so I stayed in South Korea for a couple years and while I was there I met my now wife

7:21

um but got bored of teaching and wanted to get my hands dirty so I moved back to the U.S uh and went to California and

7:27

retrained as a wind turbine engineer and one of the nice things about being in Austria is seeing all the wind turbines

7:34

uh developing wind energy and my goal is to be an engineer technician on those to

7:39

help with maintain uh maintaining repairing those um one of my contacts in Korea was a

7:47

Indian businessman based in Abu Dhabi the United Arab Emirates and he said Colin there's a uh a new

7:54

program to build a wind farm in in the United Arab Emirates and uh I can get you connected into that and there might

8:01

be some some great job opportunities to work in there so I said you know that's a that's a great idea that would be a lot more fun

8:08

than working on a wind farm in Iowa or Nebraska in the middle of nowhere in the U.S

8:13

um so as I'd done many times before I packed a small suitcase uh and I bought

8:18

a one-way ticket to Abu Dhabi and uh tried to see what I could do there I uh

8:24

found a place to live uh I reconnected with my local contact and and met with

8:30

uh the the local firm which is supposed to lead this uh this wind farm and I was

8:36

talking with them and found out that uh they had decided to cancel the wind farm uh without publicly notifying anybody

8:43

yeah yeah and instead they were going to reinvest the funding into to buying a wind farm in Denmark to my understanding

8:51

so I was in Abu Dhabi left in a lurch um but uh I had another friend who was

8:56

there uh who was working um uh at the U.S embassy and he informed

9:02

me that there were some uh uh job opportunities at the embassy uh and I

9:08

ended up applying the embassy on a on a random hunch I didn't expect to get the job um I had done my undergraduate in

9:15

international relations and of course so I was naturally thrilled at the idea of working for an embassy but I didn't have

9:21

any expectations that I would land the job but as it turns out I did and and so for the next five years I worked at the

9:28

U.S embassy in Abu Dhabi uh on a very low level as a Administrative Assistant

9:33

a file clerk helping out here and there in different sections and offices and while I was there I applied for the

9:41

U.S foreign service which is the process to become a U.S Diplomat and I was able

9:47

to pass uh the test and pass the the following series of exams and I got on a

9:53

waiting list to join the Foreign Service called call to register it's basically a list of candidates who are available

10:00

uh but unfortunately at that time they instituted a hiring freeze and so there's very little chance of of getting

10:06

off of that list um similar with the teaching job I started to get bored of working at the

10:13

embassy I sort of hit my limit of what I could learn and do and talking with my

10:18

uh estranged girlfriend in Korea we decided to finally get married and uh I

10:24

decided to to quit working at the embassy and I moved to South Korea so I packed up that suitcase and I moved back

10:31

to Seoul uh after being away for a while and uh shortly thereafter that was in

10:37

2016. my wife and I got married we've been together now for five years thank

10:43

you thank you belated congratulations so thank you thank you and um so I settled down in Seoul and uh

10:51

I decided to take Korean classes at Seoul national university to to help improve my Korean language ability and

10:59

uh so I could you know assimilate better in that Society um and at the time I was working all

11:05

these odd jobs just to make ends meet uh I was I did some English teaching work I

11:10

did um some helping out HR uh departments and different companies with their

11:15

interviews uh and also working as a as a a background actor and a lot of TV

11:21

commercials uh at the time they were preparing for the Winter Olympics and they needed some foreigners to peer in

11:27

their promotional commercials so I would show up in the in the backgrounds of the commercials waving a a British flag or

11:33

Canadian flag look at you from from painting wind farms or maintaining wind farms in the middle of nowhere in the

11:38

U.S to a Korean film stuff yeah yeah I think that's the modern experience of a

11:45

lot of people in in my generation of rapidly changing jobs and careers

11:50

um only I've done it on a global level um so as luck is in terms of how I got with

11:56

ivi um I was at my Korean classes and I made a friend uh her name is Dr Andrea

12:03

Hasselbeck she's from Germany and she's an epidemiologist with the international vaccine Institute and she and I were

12:11

taking classes together and in between classes during our breaks we would chit chat you know talk office compare

12:18

experiences with work overseas and uh those conversations with Andrea turn

12:23

into a job opportunity um ivi had a lot of work going on a lot of grant writing a lot of research

12:30

papers and they needed some help with proofreading and editing so I took that on as a side job and got my foot in the

12:37

door at ivi as an editor and a writer uh as luck would have it maybe six

12:43

months after that fact ivi established a global Affairs office

12:49

to help facilitate its International Partnerships and its diplomatic relations

12:55

um and so I applied for that job and it was very competitive but I was able to to land that job and and that's how I

13:03

started at ivi right right yeah congratulations uh it's an exciting

13:08

story from I mean it has everything adversity overcoming adversity

13:13

long-distance relationship I guess when I hear the threat your wife was in Korea while you were uh stuck in the United

13:21

Arab Emirates is that right yeah we tried to do um the long distance thing I think we

13:27

made up and broke up more times than I can count uh sometimes she would visit

13:32

me I would visit her I don't advise long-distance relationships for anyone they're a very very challenging but this

13:39

one worked out but you're the best example that how can I kind of said it in English love prevails so it's uh

13:46

yeah love prevails yeah if you're stubborn enough or fool no I think it's

13:52

a love is always quite love is always good uh let's get a little bit away from from love although it's a great topic to

13:59

talk about and uh dive deeper into ivi it was in 1997 you mentioned that API

14:06

was founded uh why what was the reason uh I mean I have a farmer background so

14:12

I mean basically vaccines produced by the farmer industry um I had developing a company that was a

14:21

vaccine developer in Europe in Vienna Austria a couple of years ago it was

14:27

part I think by MSD during the pandemic and I was at the picture that's the major problems uh that vaccines can

14:34

solve have been solved already why was it necessary to found IBI in in the 90s

14:39

and maintain it up to 2023 sure um so the foundation of ivi which

14:45

happened in 1997 uh actually goes back a little further uh into the late 80s

14:51

early 90s uh with the establishment of a predecessor organization called the

14:56

children's vaccine initiative now the children's vaccine initiative or CVI was established as a collaborative

15:04

effort between the World Health Organization the World Bank the United Nations development program and the

15:11

Rockefeller Foundation a U.S philanthropoc philanthropic organization and these organizations came together to

15:19

form CVI to address a critical problem the World Health Organization had set up

15:26

the the Epi standards the expanded program on immunizations a list of

15:31

standard vaccines that you know every child in every country should receive and at the time on the Epi you had

15:38

um measles dtp which is diphtheria pertussis

15:43

tetanus it had meat uh you had oral polio vaccine as well as BCG the

15:49

childhood tuberculosis vaccine and while countries were rolling that out there were still a great lag and and

15:58

countries adopting the Epi Epi vaccine list and there was uptake problems and

16:04

we still had millions of children dying of vaccine preventable diseases um in Africa and especially in in Asia

16:11

Pacific region so CVI was established to try to to counter that by increasing uh vaccine

16:20

uptake through the Epi system and also developing new vaccines that were not

16:26

included unhappy for infectious diseases of high burden in these developing countries

16:32

um and these vaccines had not been developed by a major pharmaceutical companies that because there was no uh

16:39

no Market incentive we're talking diseases like uh cholera and typhoid uh

16:44

waterborne diarrheal diseases um that are not really a problem in the West

16:51

um so CVI uh worked for over a period of about eight years

16:57

um addressing those problems and what they found uh at the center of the problem

17:03

um was the lack of a mechanism to connect the entire all the elements of

17:08

vaccine developments and I think it's important to conceptualize the vaccine development process to have a full

17:14

picture of what we need to develop vaccines um you know we we start vaccines in the

17:20

laboratory scientists and researchers are playing with antigens playing with

17:26

molecules seeing what they can get to work and developing um a vaccine candidate a vaccine

17:33

prototype um and that happens all over the world and that was happening but a lot of

17:38

those vaccine prototypes would uh sit on the Shelf they wouldn't move any further because of lack of funding or access to

17:45

What's called the translational development process and that's where we figure out how to scale up the

17:51

manufacture of a vaccine candidate from something inside of a beaker to something at 10 liters or 50 liters even

17:58

100 liters so you can Mass produce That vaccine and

18:03

so that's one another additional process that um again was happening independently you

18:09

know sometimes a vaccine would be developed but it would never be the process would not be developed

18:14

um and then there was technology transfer questions you know once you develop a vaccine and the process

18:19

development you have to to move it to a manufacturer who's qualified and licensed to manufacture That vaccine

18:26

next up you have to have clinical trials you have to have your your three phases of clinical trials to demonstrate safety

18:33

and efficacy uh and there are plenty of organizations uh that handle clinical

18:39

trials that process clinical trials but they do it on an ad hoc basis on a per request basis

18:46

um and and outside of the actual vaccine development then you have the the government aspects you have the

18:52

licensure and the regulatory approval that's required by the uh host country

18:57

governor of the manufacturer and as well as the the country that receives the vaccine these vaccines have to be

19:02

licensed and regulated not only by individual countries but also by World Health Organization through the

19:08

pre-qualification process then you actually have the manufacturing process you have to have a profitable

19:14

sustainable manufacturing process and then on the the uptake side you have to have either a market or a government

19:20

which is purchasing those vaccines uh taking them building up stockpiles and delivering them to their populations

19:28

um and that all is informed by evidence um you have to have epidemiology you have to have uh disease surveillance in

19:35

the fields to understand the true burden of diseases uh and and host country populations

19:41

you also need economic studies to to inform policy makers you have to show

19:46

the the cost of illness if you have an untreated disease among in amidst the

19:51

population what's the economic cost of that as well as the humanitarian cost and if you develop a vaccine uh and that

19:59

country decides to to buy That vaccine uh what's the return on investment uh what you know how many lives are they

20:06

saving how is that contributing to the the economy how is that reducing dalys

20:11

and then you need the vaccine efficacy studies to show that the vaccine can work in different regions of different

20:17

populations so to summarize all those those elements up until that time were disjointed they

20:23

were taking part piecemeal ad hoc and CVI tried to bridge all those to build

20:29

up a system that could lead a vaccine through every one of those stages through the development through Tech

20:36

transfer through manufacture through regulatory approval um and they did make some progress so I

20:43

think by the time that CVI closed up in 1997 1998 uh Epi uh attainment levels

20:51

had gotten up to 80 in most countries and so there was a lot to celebrate um but eventually the support for for

20:58

CVI ran out but before it did two other organizations were established

21:03

uh that mirrored the work of of uh CVI uh the first one was ivi which was

21:09

established through the CVI Institute initiative in 1997 and the second was

21:15

Gabby and Gabby was also established by CVI in the year 2000 uh and you can see

21:22

today if you can compare ivi and Gabby you can trace the roots back to that model ivi is on the Upstream of things

21:29

handling the the vaccine r d the transfers the manufacturing where's

21:35

Gabby's on the downstream uh you know trying to incentivize uptake and purchasing and delivery

21:41

um and that's that's really where we came from um in terms of how ivi was established

21:48

they decided to establish us as an international organization to give us

21:53

um a greater sense of of stature and Independence that CVI was lacking uh CVI

22:00

was never really formalized as an organization it was more of a of an alliance but ivi is as a as an Institute

22:07

as an organization with backing from countries would be able to fill the gaps

22:12

that CGI was not able to address now when the untp was leading the

22:17

process to develop ivi they decided to host it in Asia Pacific because that's

22:25

where a lot of the the Epi um fallback was located that's where there was Epi failure uptakes and

22:32

there's still a lot of death from infectious diseases so they decided to host the nation there

22:37

was a competition uh between five countries if there was China South Korea

22:43

Philippines uh Thailand Hong Kong and South Korea ended up winning outs

22:50

um they had the I guess the most persuasive package to offer um and they offered to build a a massive

22:58

headquarters facility including laboratories on the campus of Seoul national university

23:03

[Music] Korea South Korea is a beautiful country and uh with I think uh they are a little

23:11

bit advanced in biotech research I mean the last time I was in South Korea was 2017-18 uh in these years and we visited

23:18

Samsung and I learned there that Samsung is uh investing a lot in biotech research can you highlight a little bit

23:25

the life science Biotech Industry in South South Korea from your from the IBI perspective

23:31

sure um so from the ivi perspective uh in in the lifetime of ivi we've seen a

23:37

significant growth in in Korea's uh biotech sector uh partially assisted by

23:43

ivi um if we look back to the year I want to

23:48

say 2006 there was a SARS outbreak and uh

23:54

maybe it was 2013. my apologies if I'm getting the dates wrong um and there was a SARS outbreak and um

24:01

Korea needed some flu vaccines and they

24:06

had an agreement with the with the manufacturers in the United States to to purchase and Supply those vaccines but

24:13

amidst the outbreak the U.S government intervened and said well actually we have the first rights on those vaccines

24:19

and since there's a global Health Emergency we will be taking those vaccines uh and not letting them go to

24:25

Korea um so Korea was left in the Lurch and uh was shocked by that development uh and

24:32

decided that they need to make significant Investments uh in their Biotech Industry to ensure that Curry

24:39

had a stronger uh vaccine manufacturing and r d capacity so they would no longer

24:45

be reliant on vaccines of critical National Health security

24:50

uh and so through a number of Investments um both in basic r d but also in

24:55

manufacturing uh a number of Korean biotechs have been able to grow up and

25:01

emerge Samsung has its life sciences SK also has a life science department which

25:07

we work with closely um I I think sort of a flagship for ivi's partnership uh has been new

25:13

biologics EU biologics uh was a very small biotech firm had never made a

25:18

vaccine uh but we were able to take the oral cholera vaccine that we had developed and reformulated and

25:25

transferred to biologics and do biologics uh was able to step up uh uh

25:32

get that vaccine licensured and licensed and who pre-qualified and is now one of

25:37

the main significant Global suppliers of oral cholera vaccine and so now

25:44

yeah sorry to interrupt you okay no anytime anytime so the so now we we see

25:50

in Korea and it's a continuing initiative is um create is is now uh an example for

25:56

other countries to follow of how uh Investments uh across the Spectrum and

26:02

uh basic research translation research clinical trial capacity manufacturing capacity

26:09

um uh end up producing uh a network in an environment uh for vaccine

26:14

manufacturing and and Supply I couldn't agree more I think the pandemic was to

26:19

best prove what's possible in the industry when everybody is working together was pretty much impressed by

26:25

the achievement I never thought it's possible to develop a new vaccine uh

26:31

basically from scratch in one year and distributed to the people uh it was what

26:36

that manufacturing is a huge bottleneck but if everything is working together

26:42

um it works fine let's have a look at it cycle of a vaccine and how IBI can help my background is business and I was

26:49

involved in vaccine development as I mentioned before a couple of years ago it's almost 10 years ago now and from my

26:56

perspective it's always pretty simple what I have to do so as a business Expert um I have to look at the Pharma industry

27:02

see what needs they Define Obama companies usually uh listed a public

27:08

companies listed on a stock market so they have to take commercial rules very

27:14

seriously otherwise the simply would cease to exist and this means they need a business model a revenue model that

27:21

needs enough cases in the world they need someone to pay

27:26

um and they need to make a profit otherwise they would not fulfill the mission and for me as a business Expert

27:33

in clinical development with clinical development it's pretty simple when I see enough cases when I see the

27:38

potential for players on the market we can come to the conclusion we have a business case it makes sense to invest

27:45

some capital I can approach investors investors put money in it later off we license the vaccine to the Pharma

27:52

companies you mentioned before and there's always very often that unfortunately uh when no payers exist so

28:00

nobody wants to cover the cost of the vaccine when it's distributed to the patient so to the

28:06

um to to the people at the end of the day then we don't have a business case otherwise also when there are not

28:12

sufficient cases uh then we don't have a business case but the need still exists now I learned from you that IBI as far

28:20

as you understood your explanation is set up to fix that problem so to pick up uh uh challenges that's the farm

28:28

industry would turn down and let's face it let's walk through the weather chain I think let's start with basic research

28:34

let's explore a little bit what IBI how IBI can help basic researchers let's

28:39

look at pre-clinical development Tech transfer clinical development then bringing the thing to the market the

28:46

vaccine and at the end of the day also let's have a look at the government

28:51

level and see what IBI is doing there uh let's start with the basic researchers so what what if a basic researcher comes

28:59

to me and they say yes a nice idea but I don't think that there is a market because nobody pays for it and there are

29:05

no patients uh what's FBI's role in that in that part of the value chain okay so

29:11

I'm going to actually go one step behind you and and start with evidence um and and this is a basis on ivi's

29:18

History uh so ivi's first major Global program uh was something called Domi which is diseases of diseases of uh the

29:26

most impoverished initiative and this was uh made possible by funding from The Gates Foundation and what Domi did is it

29:33

did a comprehensive um uh disease burden study a massive

29:39

surveillance epidemiological operation across Asia and parts of Africa to

29:44

determine what the true burden of um these neglected diseases were

29:49

um we conducted surveillance primarily for cholera uh typhoid

29:54

um and HIV meningitis rotavirus and shigella

30:01

um to figure out what the true burdens of these diseases were uh and in each case it could be slightly different

30:07

um in the cases of Cholera and typhoid we know for example that it can be seasonal

30:12

um that it can pop up during rainy periods and flooding periods in certain countries

30:17

um but that also that some countries don't like to report on their their burden of collar and typhoid uh because

30:24

it's bad for Investments uh and a lot of officials believe that if they can just

30:29

Advance their their wash infrastructure that cholera antifoid will magically go

30:34

away so what we found is in many countries cholera and typhoid were vastly

30:39

unreported um and there was an endemic problem that was being ignored that was costing lives

30:46

and and and holding back the economy so what we do first and foremost and what

30:52

we're still doing today is is disease surveillance in the fields um and the the final products of those

30:58

epidemiological projects are one disease burden data and evidence and and that's how you start to

31:06

identify the need for a vaccine you see that uh x amount of people are are

31:11

infected or suffering or dying from from these diseases uh and then you look at the economic

31:17

work and we also conduct the the economic studies we see you know what's the the cost of illness for this disease

31:22

what's what's the dally you know what are the we we take surveys we see what are people's perceptions of these

31:28

diseases and on a potential desire for a vaccine um and with that evidence we're able to

31:34

design uh develop what are called vaccine investment cases investment strategies uh we share those with gavi

31:40

uh as well as with decision makers in country to show look you have this disease you have this problem uh and if

31:48

you invest in in vaccine uptake or vaccine r d in some cases then we can

31:53

begin a virtuous upcycle uh in addressing this problem so getting into

31:59

basic research so we start with

32:09

um so you you pay for the studies and you do the studies basically to find out

32:14

uh what is the real disease burn but it's still real economic burn of a disease how many people are affected and

32:21

whether it makes sense to do something against it or not did I understand it right yeah so it now that brings up the

32:28

funding question uh an important part to realize is that ivi is primarily funded uh through philanthropy and governments

32:35

uh and grants um 90 of our our funding typically comes from Project grants uh which we have to

32:42

uh compete for uh on on the open Grant Market uh which we're pretty good at

32:48

doing we have a pretty good reputation at securing grants but not always as well as funding that we get from some of

32:54

our Our member states um what's great when we do get uh core funding from our member states is that

33:00

funds and Independence uh research projects uh so we can take for example

33:06

core funding for member states and invest it directly in an epidemiological epidemiology program or in basic

33:13

research um that's we don't always have access to that funding

33:18

um but when we do we we try to use it to Target those exact diseases that have no

33:24

Market incentive yeah I think even there is no business case for these studies except getting grants on that

33:31

um when it comes to forming public opinion I think as long as the burden is not felt that there is no willingness to

33:37

pay and without your studies the willingness to pay is not there so

33:43

basically it's quite impressive what you do I think in times of the internet uh when I Google something it always feels

33:49

like the data is always there but somebody has to produce the data before Google can recognize it and your entity

33:56

is doing that in the vaccine development I didn't know that yeah yeah we've we've produced quite a

34:02

few of the the peer-reviewed journal articles out there establishing the burden for a wide variety of diseases

34:07

and we're currently improving that on typhoid as well which we can get into in a little while yeah

34:13

um so once once we know a basic need we can look at uh basic research on vaccine

34:19

development now there's a couple ways we can approach that first of all ivi has its own Laboratories

34:25

um going up to bsl3 and we are able to initiate basic research in our own Laboratories uh we've done that right

34:33

now with the invasive non-tiphotal salmonella vaccine candidate as well as a shigella vaccine candidate and a

34:40

number of uh smaller grants that we've been working on on some hemorrhagic fever vaccines and some other vaccine

34:46

initiatives to improve pre-existing vaccines alternatively what we can do is we can

34:54

partner up with uh private biotechs Academia research institutes that have

35:01

developed those basic vaccine candidates and we can test them we can run them

35:06

through animal models we have a animal facility for testing we can develop ad

35:13

events and essays for those vaccines and and demonstrates the effectiveness

35:19

of this and again it's about that cycle so if we can demonstrate that we have a basic vaccine candidate we can go to

35:25

philanthropy we can go to governments and we can say here's a promising candidate if you provide us funding we

35:32

can carry it to the next stage so in the first step you identify the need in the

35:37

Second Step you also help with your own Laboratories to develop vaccine candidates or any entity any company any

35:44

basic research institution any University who believes they have something that helps ease to burn can

35:52

approach you and you evaluate standard project and work together with this entity my question is from coming from

35:59

the business side again which model do we run is it a co-development model is

36:04

it uh is it a cro model that basically you say okay give us your vaccine uh we

36:09

test it out and you pay for it what how is that set up between the energy um all of the above um we've we've taken all of

36:16

those approaches and into developing vaccines um you know we're a bit of a a unique uh

36:22

organism as an organization legally we're International Organization uh we function as a research institute and we

36:30

develop products or a product development partner um so yeah all of those cases apply

36:35

they're all valid and and they all work in terms of putting out of a vaccine uh

36:41

I can tell you in the case of our non-tiphotal salmonella vaccine we developed it with our own money uh and

36:47

then we presented it to the welcome trust they saw the value in the vaccine and are now funding uh additional stages

36:54

going into phase one clinical trials eventually um in other cases I can think of uh

37:00

there's the uh vaccine at uh Harvard uh working on

37:06

tuberculosis and so we're in we're helping them with the early pre-clinical

37:11

stages of developing that we're in the standard rights that when you sign agreements uh it's not for profit

37:18

basically your work so you cover your expenses and you're not planning for being profitable that's right so Avi is a non-profit

37:24

organization and when it comes to IP uh we don't maintain the IP on on these

37:30

vaccines uh we freely Tech transfer these vaccines to manufacturers who are

37:35

ready and willing and able to manufacture them and when we do co-develop a vaccine with a partner

37:42

um we require what's called a global access agreement um a standard model that also the Gates

37:47

Foundation uses that promises that if a vaccine is successfully developed that

37:53

the manufacturer or the IP Holder will make a certain amount of doses available each year for use in global Public

37:59

Health that's cool and that's and that's the model that we've been able to sustain with you biologics which has

38:06

successfully filled that who vaccine stockpile for cholera so you basically have facilitated and enabler in the

38:12

industry that you pick up cases and help moving them forward very proactively and actively it's not just politics that you

38:19

do you also get your hands dirty in vaccine development and do the hard work in the laboratory Laboratory yeah that a

38:27

big difference between ivi and a lot of the other Global players our partners and friends and organizations like gavi

38:35

and sepi and the global fund is that we're executors we we do the actual work

38:41

um I think the governments and International Development agencies they

38:47

like organizations like gavi and sepi uh Global fund because they're Downstream they can donate lots of money to Gabby

38:54

sepi Global fund and then those organizations handle the money to funds basic research or the fund uptake

39:02

um whereas we're actually in the nitty-gritty doing the work yeah I think this is also the huge

39:07

problem that I see in any not only in vaccines but also in other areas there's a lot of funding especially in Europe

39:12

there's a lot of funding and basic research um once a product has proven that it works

39:19

there's also enough Partners to distribute it to the patients or people

39:25

in terms of vaccines they're not patients yet mostly and but in between especially in Europe there's a huge

39:31

funding Gap so I think a little bit more funding and uh Helping Hands that the area would be great what is your role in

39:38

clinical development and preclinical development um so yeah as as you're just alluding to

39:43

so there's the great problem of the translational graveyard we have lots of wonderful vaccine candidates sitting on

39:51

shelves around the world collecting dust instead of saving lives and that's because

39:56

um they lack the funding uh to push those vaccines through translational development to turn them from prototypes

40:02

into viable products and then defines manufacturers who are willing to do that so we facilitate that process we're able

40:10

to do that in-house we have the the vaccine process development in-house that we can do for other products uh

40:17

other partner vaccines external vaccines uh and then we also have a strong

40:22

network of uh of CMOS around the world and and clinical trial sites so one of

40:30

the nice things about our epidemiology Network that we have is it also doubles into a clinical trial Network

40:36

around the world in 40 different countries that once we have a vaccine

40:41

scaled up to manufacturing actually you know what we do a lot is as part of the tech transfers we work

40:48

with developing country vaccine manufacturers um we we can move a vaccine candidates

40:54

to India or Vietnam or Indonesia

41:00

uh even Bangladesh now South Africa as well where they can they have a better

41:06

economy as a scale and a lower production costs and that's where we can get the the first trial batches

41:12

manufactured for clinical trials uh and if we demonstrate Effectiveness through clinical trials then of course continue

41:18

manufacturing there I think in the case of Europe that's something that European

41:23

biotechs can start looking into is as vaccine manufacturing capacity grows

41:29

around the worlds European developers should realize that they could manufacture their vaccines in

41:35

Africa Latin America or Asia and maintain profitability in doing so

41:41

the other world is a bit different in 2023 than it was in the 90s so I think

41:46

also the images that you described evolved but uh we spared one part and I

41:52

wanted to pick on every one to pick on that I mean uh CMOS uh um crows they're all great they're all

41:59

doing a great work but at least the ones that I know don't work for free for me so they always wants to be paid I think

42:06

it's also in your case that they don't cover their expenses themselves and are suddenly become a philanthropic entity

42:12

they also need money the big question that I have and the big bottleneck I always see in Europe is

42:19

funding how do you how do you get the funding how do you mobilize capital for

42:24

these areas so again there's multiple areas so first ivi doesn't manufacture vaccines

42:31

um we go up to process development before we transfer and um

42:36

part of that part one possible solution again is the the global access agreement where the manufacturer will be able to

42:44

manufacture x amount of doses for sale in the private sector on another amount

42:49

of doses for use in public health um but then also uh from our grant

42:55

applications um some of the grants that we apply for right will include

43:01

um funding for uh transfer to cdos or cdmos so basically it's grants and how can how

43:09

can we um motivate private investors to put money in do you have anything on the

43:15

agenda yeah so I mean it's it's that's an interesting question of you know Venture

43:20

Capital uh in investing in vaccine development vaccine manufacturing I

43:26

think there is a space um we're working with a vaccine developer in the US and Texas on a

43:32

covid-19 vaccine uh variants and they have Venture Capital funding and and I

43:39

think what you have to do from a finance perspective is what what's your Roi what's your profit

43:46

margin looking at um are you willing to take a little bit of a cut to see this this candidate get through the get

43:52

through the process um if you can accept the the global access agreements

43:57

um which you know might cut off you know one or two percent of your of your margin is that acceptable or not

44:05

um it could be because once that vaccine is out there it might be the only vaccine available on the market and

44:10

you'll have you know exclusive access on the market yeah I think the when I look at the

44:16

outlier um yes 2020 to 2023 I think I was really

44:21

impressed how quick the industry moves but when I look before 2020 I think the the investing Market was pretty tried up

44:28

for vaccines there was not much going at least I was not aware of that was much going on and the fear that after 2022 we

44:34

go back to to normal what strengths do you see in financing for vaccines is there still this uh spirit of uh let's

44:43

solve uh the biggest problems and put money you know are we coming back to pre-pandemic levels with funding uh so

44:51

far so good from what I get from my perspective things are are sustained at the current level um one organization that we're working

44:58

with in the US is open philanthropy and they're gradually expanding their funding for some of our vaccine

45:03

development programs which is a promising sign and open philanthropy is a very interesting model where but your

45:10

Capital investors will all pull their funding together and then um in a very Dynamic level pick

45:15

promising projects uh like ivi vaccine development projects um to advance

45:22

so I think the the question that I have to deal with from a government relations

45:27

perspective is attention and interest from policy makers and governments

45:32

um they realize that that vaccines and Global health and infectious diseases are a problem but they're very quickly

45:39

overtaken by other events I should just chat this is this entity open philanthropy yes that's correct

45:46

also doing grants for vaccine researchers so if somebody who listens to our episodes doesn't know that so

45:54

something where you can apply for grounds for boxing development it's also important to highlight the role of sepi

45:59

the Coalition of epidemic preparedness initiatives um sepi was established prior to the uh

46:06

kova 19 outbreak actually just I think two years before it uh it happens and uh

46:12

they're a funding mechanism uh where they bring in funding from governments and uh industry and philanthropy to

46:19

advance uh clinical trial uh Clinic medical trial development of vaccines up

46:24

to stage two in most cases some sometimes up to stage three for diseases

46:29

that have an emerging emerging pandemic potential um so uh covid-19 is a big one another

46:37

one they're looking at is chikungunya or Nipa uh and that's sepi has has made a

46:43

significant contribution towards uh towards addressing that funding Gap

46:49

and uh you know I think there is sustained support from governments and

46:54

and private sector of supporting sepi um and sepi is an answer for a lot of

46:59

these diseases but sepi isn't the answer for all all vaccines because again there

47:05

are specific focuses on vaccines with the pandemic potential but there are plenty of diseases out there that have

47:11

uh sustained uh endemic burden uh long-term and low and middle income

47:17

countries that have no threat of spreading uh towards the West which

47:22

still need to be funded let's let's stay a little bit with uh the regions that

47:28

you mentioned Asia Africa and Latin America I mean challenge that there is an opportunity

47:33

to develop a vaccine um can we explore a bit the situation and unique challenges and opportunities

47:40

in each region that start with with uh I know it's a big region and it's unfair

47:45

to call it that Asia I think this is two parts of the global population on behalf

47:51

of the global population uh which unique challenges do you see in Asia for vaccine development

47:58

um one interesting the one that's that's come up especially in covid-19 is uh regulatory approval

48:05

um so we work with asean the association of Southeast Asian Nations which is a an

48:11

international organization or Community similar to the EU which incorporates a

48:16

number of the countries in Southeast Asia and uh we've been working with the

48:21

national vaccine Institute in Thailand and other partners Within asean to explore how we can improve vaccine

48:28

uptake and access within asean um if you look in asean you have a wide

48:34

variety of um of development levels you have high income countries like

48:39

Singapore you have low-income countries like Lao or Cambodia and you have

48:45

middle-income countries like Vietnam and Indonesia and all of them have varying

48:51

capacity for basic research for vaccine r d for clinical trials management and

48:57

Manufacturing and so the question is can we build uh a

49:03

system within asean that will coordinate uh comprehensive vaccine development

49:10

between those Partners as well as a pan regulatory Authority within asean

49:16

um so that's that's an interesting way of looking at you know we work with Indonesia for example they're

49:23

manufactured biopharma on on developing and Manufacturing a new typhoid conjugate vaccine and we've also worked

49:30

historically with Vietnam on cholera vaccine so there's a lot of potential there to develop vaccines and

49:37

to be frank in the last you know 25 years Asia has you know done a miraculous job of addressing uh

49:45

childhood illnesses from infectious disease and improving the the Epi levels um what you run into with a lot of these

49:51

middle-income countries though uh be it Indonesia or Malaysia or Vietnam is the

49:57

the middle income gap or what's sometimes called the Gabby Gap where low-income countries have access to

50:04

Gabby subsidation for vaccine uptick but as their economy grows and they transition out they gradually lose

50:12

access to those low price uh low prices low cost price agreements or vaccines

50:17

and they gradually are put in a position where they have to buy vaccines at the

50:22

going Market rates which makes those vaccines unavailable for their populations

50:29

um turning points that when countries

50:34

become let's put it down to richer they fall out of this agreement where they get access cheap access to vaccines and

50:41

then they have to pay is it such a huge Turning Point that's the countries then can't afford it

50:46

luckily it's it's not a huge on off switch um Gabby works very closely with those

50:52

countries on a transition process where it's uh in many cases delayed or drawn

50:57

out so that it doesn't have a front impact and you can look at the the

51:03

Nationwide statistics and and things look okay but then you have on the individual level

51:09

um uh need for vaccines like uh uh mnemonic pneumonococcal conjugate

51:16

vaccine which are very expensive um and become even more expensive when you have to buy them on the private

51:22

Market um there's some interesting things we're working on uh when in case of uh human

51:27

papillonavirus HPV um so there are vaccines available on the market and uh what we've done in

51:34

Thailand is uh conducted a study to prove that a single dose of vaccine is

51:40

uh similarly effective to three doses of vaccine and that evidence uh has has led to

51:47

approval for use of of one dose of vaccine and that will significantly reduce costs for countries in providing

51:54

those vaccines to their population this is a great success congratulations congratulations thank you thank you so

52:01

Asia is a success story um and of course you have to look um if you really want to talk about Asia you have to look at the PowerHouse of

52:08

India as a vaccine manufacturer and developer um I think it's something like India

52:14

supplies something like 70 of the world's vaccines in terms of consumptions 70 I might be wrong on the

52:21

number but it's it's really really high out yeah a significant amount of the world's vaccines are manufactured in

52:27

India in consuming you so you're looking at the populations in Asia and in Africa using Indian vaccines from manufacturers

52:33

like serum Institute um just I'm just curious sorry to interrupt you um interrupting

52:40

um India is manufacturing basically for the Pharma industry globally do you also

52:45

know for Europe do we get most of our vaccinations from India already

52:50

I think there are some vaccines in your that are manufactured in India but I don't have the full scope yeah off the

52:58

top of my head yeah I I was hoping you can close my knowledge gaps yeah very

53:03

quickly but I know some Indian vaccines have received a licensure EMA approval

53:08

India has evolved tremendously in the last 20 years I had I think two years ago I had a colleague who started a

53:15

company in India or already in the 90s and it's impressive what they said how the entire ecosystem evolved during the

53:22

last uh two or three decades yeah um Asia has also been the centerpiece

53:29

for ivi's vaccine technology transfers um which we've done considerable work on

53:34

the oral cholera vaccine uh that we developed originally came from Jan

53:40

hulgrim at University at Gothenburg in Sweden uh and then it was manufactured

53:45

in Vietnam by VA biotech under the name uh orcvac or morkvac and we were able to

53:52

take that vaccine uh and reformulate it into a more effective low-cost version

53:57

and transfer that from Vietnam to India to shantha biotechnics and later we were

54:04

able to transfer that vaccine uh to uh to

54:10

Bangladeshi company and SEPTA and my apologies for interrupting again but I

54:15

think I have to put your organization into a different uh bucket uh it sounds

54:21

to me when you say we we got the hold on the vaccine and we developed it and transferred it it sounds more to me like

54:27

you're acting like like a pharmaceutical company that you how do you do it commercially to your license the vaccine

54:33

uh to get the licensing rights uh then IRS CMO or ctmo to produce the vaccine

54:40

is it how can you imagine that how do you do that so we do it again through through

54:45

agreements with the the IP holders the license holders um again we don't take the license we don't hold the IP

54:53

um it's it's on a voluntary basis with with the the owners of that IP whether they want to work on it or not on that

54:59

project but you were really more handsomething any other organization on on the similar to yours that's right

55:06

that's right lots of organizations might fund such activities but we actually get them done

55:12

yeah and there's been a number of other vaccine uh uh transfers of interest you

55:17

know we uh transferred an early uh typhoid vaccine polysaccharide vaccine

55:22

from China to India and later India transferred it to Pakistan with our help

55:27

uh if we can get into vaccine diplomacy later but it's interesting to see that countries that are often in tension with

55:33

each other are able to cooperate on vaccine development that's good to know yeah

55:40

so yeah yeah go ahead how is the situation in Africa

55:46

so Africa provides a different challenge uh we're just starting now in the conversation on vaccine Manufacturing in

55:52

Africa um but what we're doing in Africa is uh building capacity uh across a wide

55:58

variety of countries um both in epidemiology and clinical trial capacity

56:04

um so in Africa we have high burdens for diseases like cholera typhoid

56:10

non-tipheral salmonella Schuster samiasis and what we do in Africa is

56:16

different from the traditional development agency model a traditional

56:22

development agency will fly into Africa with its its team and its equipment its

56:27

supplies do the work and fly out and that's not sustainable uh and that's

56:32

I don't think that's how we want to do things in the Contemporary uh future what we do instead is we lead from

56:39

behind we go into places in Africa we provide training capacity building we

56:45

provide equipments um for hot for local hospitals uh to to build their capacity in epidemiology and

56:52

in clinical trial research uh and through sustained development uh through

56:57

practice through training uh these local hospitals and research institutes and

57:02

Clinics become viable vaccine development Partners at least for the portion of collecting evidence uh

57:09

generating evidence and and conducting the clinical trials can we can we hold a little bit at this

57:15

point our capacity building uh let's dive a little bit deeper into that how

57:20

to what what is capacity building sure so simply put capacity building

57:26

means and it's it's often uh uh a meaningless term in some cases of you

57:31

know popular speak but what it basically means is it's it's it's training and empowerments uh it's giving people the

57:39

the tools uh and and abilities they need to to do the work

57:44

um and we can do that through training in our vaccinology course um it can mean

57:50

providing equipment like freezers uh microscopes office space building

57:55

construction building constructing buildings to do the work in um providing computer systems software

58:03

systems for for data managements [Music] um the fact is there's plenty of uh

58:08

within Africa there's uh educated population who are eager to work on this they have the they have the nascent

58:15

capacity they have the the basic understanding and ability to do the work they just need a step up to be able to

58:21

reach their full potential foreign

58:28

to the shop and fly out uh have you done any measurements in the last one or two

58:34

decades that show the capacity building is more effective on the long run than other approaches yeah I think in Africa

58:42

one one little statistic we'd like to cite is that through our developments we've created I think a thousand jobs in

58:48

Africa uh through our capacity building programs and that's that's a thousand people working in their Healthcare

58:55

sector uh and contributing value not just domestically but also internationally

59:00

and epidemiology and clinical trials it's advanced almost sorry also add one additional

59:09

thing is that um if you look at the career Paths of the people that we train and and when we

59:15

assist is they go on uh to to advance through the Healthcare System they end

59:20

up going into regulatory positions which then strengthen the government's ability to respond to diseases and outbreaks as

59:27

well as to license treatments so it's once once we plant the seed of

59:33

this training work the people that we work with then grow in into the sector and make a larger impact across time

59:41

it's great to hear um capacity is it something that you do occasionally uh as ivi or is it part of

59:49

your strategy that is okay uh it's very important so we put it on our strategic

59:54

portfolio list and uh moved it Forward on a larger scale yeah it's it's an integral part of our strategy uh

1:00:02

providing training um one example we like to cite or one model we'd like to cite is

1:00:07

um South South triangular cooperation um another buzzword but it actually does

1:00:13

have significant meaning um in in our work uh we look across the

1:00:18

the Spectrum at low middle income countries and we see uh individuals and institutes and countries that have a

1:00:25

piece of the puzzle they have something that contributes something that they're excelling at and we can bring them

1:00:31

together uh to to build each other's capacity so for example we could take

1:00:37

um um clinical researchers from Nepal uh for example take them to India and use

1:00:43

our and our partners in India we'll we'll train them uh and in more advanced clinical procedures and then they'll go

1:00:50

off and do the work themselves we actually did that with North Korean uh epidemiologists uh in the early 2000s we

1:00:58

took them from North Korea and brought them to China and Vietnam for more advanced training and and capacity

1:01:04

building and vaccine delivery um and so as a result instead of this

1:01:09

top-down model where um you know different countries Low Middle countries

1:01:15

are continually dependents on high income countries for training capacity building by linking them together they

1:01:22

can train each other and and build upon each other's abilities I mean that is same thing since we

1:01:28

mentioned North Korea um so there is collaboration also with North Korea

1:01:35

there was in the past uh currently there is none because of the sanctions

1:01:40

um we we would work in North Korea if we could we I think we have a a plan sitting on a shelf somewhere of projects

1:01:46

that we could work on um in the past we were able to conduct uh epidemiology programs capacity

1:01:53

building and some vaccination campaigns against uh Japanese Encephalitis and HIV

1:01:59

meningitis I'm a European I believe in peaceful collaboration so I think this is uh it's

1:02:05

good with countries or people from different countries work together it helps to create more understanding for

1:02:12

uh the similarities and also for differences yeah yeah we're willing to work with uh

1:02:19

with anyone to save lives in any country that's a great attitude yeah

1:02:27

when we look uh Africa it's mostly capacity building we discussed a little bit about Asia I mean I would really

1:02:34

love to dive very deep into each topic but also don't want to use too much of

1:02:39

your time it's really fun talking to you and we are already with uh at one hour uh that's why I suggest let's move on to

1:02:46

Latin America how is the situation that we've highlight a little bit Latin America sure so in Latin America

1:02:53

um historically ivi's presence in Latin America focused on mosquito-borne diseases and so throughout the 2000s and

1:03:02

2010s we worked very closely with Partners in Latin America um across Central America and South

1:03:08

America on disease surveillance um for and Regulatory uh research on

1:03:16

Dengue [Music] um and zika uh once the zika outbreak uh

1:03:21

took place uh and from Brazil and uh recently we've been working on Chikungunya so for those who aren't

1:03:28

aware of what Chikungunya is it is a debilitating infectious disease a virus

1:03:34

spread by mosquitoes and while it's not often lethal um Chikungunya causes

1:03:41

um um something similar to arthritis where it causes joints inflammation and pain

1:03:46

which prevents people from being able to move from preventing people to work so

1:03:51

it has a an enormous impact on on dalys and and economic uh developments in

1:03:58

these countries So currently we're conducting a clinical trial uh in let's

1:04:03

see here uh in Costa Rica Panama and Colombia uh on a chikunguny vaccine

1:04:11

developed by bahara biotech in India and so we're conducting uh phase two

1:04:17

clinical trials now on that vaccine uh and in Latin America a lot of the partners there already have

1:04:24

um good capacity good regulatory capacity good clinical trial capacity so there's not so much

1:04:30

um uh training going on there so much as it is cooperation however um Panama recently uh ratified

1:04:40

the Ibis establishment agreement and we're in early talks of uh perhaps

1:04:45

hosting some uh some training there where we can bring in researchers uh from across Latin and South America and

1:04:52

bring them into Panama City and provide a vaccinology course to local researchers

1:04:58

you mentioned two DCC stenge and Chikungunya why is it so challenging to develop a vaccine for that I mean I

1:05:04

remember it was already a problem 10 years ago and 10 years ago it was I think already a long lasting problem

1:05:10

from a few decades before why is it so challenging to bring something effective to the market

1:05:16

I think the problem I mean every vaccine provides its own unique problems you're

1:05:22

probably aware of the fact that ninety percent of all vaccines uh fail at some point in their developments

1:05:29

um so the the ability to get a functional vaccine all the way through pre-clinical and clinical trials is

1:05:36

incredibly difficult and challenging um you know sanofi experienced that with their their dinghy vaccine

1:05:43

um where they found that the the vaccine could cause some adverse effects of

1:05:49

people who have already been infected with dinghy prior to vaccination um so the the ding we actually helped uh

1:05:56

with the Dengue vaccine candidate which is now all I think in in final steps with um

1:06:03

uh bhutantan in Brazil um so the U.S NIH the National Institutes of Health developed a vaccine

1:06:10

candidate for Dengue and we helped conduct the technology transfer of that

1:06:15

to Brazil uh and helped assist some of the early clinical trial stages of that

1:06:20

and I think they're they're approaching licensure now of That vaccine so I think it's just again it's a matter

1:06:27

of developing that virtuous cycle of policy makers and investors be realizing

1:06:33

that there is a need for the vaccine that there's a demand for the vaccine and and the value that That vaccine will

1:06:39

deliver uh uh to the population uh not only uh in terms of health but economics

1:06:45

as well I mean it's 10 years ago that I have read studies on chicken but the Assumption was with climate change and

1:06:52

increasing global warming uh more people will be affected in future uh from this

1:06:58

virus so it will go more northwards um and I think I also saw parts of Europe

1:07:04

is it is it still the same assumption that uh with climate change we will see

1:07:09

more cases also in the northern hemisphere yeah I think it's it's highly likely that we will see

1:07:16

um climate change make an impact on the spreads of of these diseases um uh we're seeing that with Chikungunya

1:07:22

um where previously in Latin America it was isolated in certain areas um but it wasn't in in the colder

1:07:29

Highlands but now that those thailands are warming up you're seeing more chikungunyu cases

1:07:34

um there's the I think I've even heard that it's been found in Texas already so again sepi is funding our vaccine

1:07:42

clinical trial cassette is aware that this this vaccine has a potential to spread uh on a high level into the

1:07:49

northern hemisphere and affect large populations let's step a little bit into science

1:07:55

fiction I mean when I started in vaccine development I was hoping to learn that

1:08:00

uh we have the potential to find a vaccine that basically wipes out the

1:08:05

virus and you vaccinate the population one time and everything is uh is done do you see something coming like that that

1:08:12

we can find the technology that makes vaccines so effective that we can basically eradicate certain viruses or

1:08:20

is it something too far in the future well you know I'm more of a diplomat so

1:08:25

I'm not a vaccine scientist so I can't comment too much on it um that being said

1:08:32

um the the technological innovations that have popped up recently with with mRNA for example and DNA as well

1:08:40

um are showing some promise and Effectiveness but whether or not you can eliminate disease entirely is another

1:08:46

question I mean we know from uh economic and and infrastructure

1:08:52

development in the west that we were able to eliminate cholera and typhoid you know if I go and read the newspapers

1:08:58

from my hometown from the 1880s there were regular cholera outbreaks in downtown Cincinnati

1:09:03

uh that doesn't happen anymore because we we closed down the the stagnant swamps that were running through the

1:09:09

city um so we know that it can disappear from certain locations but again there's

1:09:15

always the potential for an environmental Reservoir um one interesting study we're doing now

1:09:21

um so ivi developed a new typhoid vaccine and um in order to generate evidence on its

1:09:27

Effectiveness and use uh we're currently conducting uh uh a vaccination campaign

1:09:33

in uh in Fiji and in the Northern

1:09:38

Ireland of Fiji to see if we can eliminate typhoid entirely from the islands

1:09:44

um the hypothesis is that if we vaccinate enough people and establish herd immunity that we could make typhoid

1:09:49

disappear from uh from a contained population however there's also the possibility that there is an

1:09:55

environmental reservoir of typhoid in the water sources there um so once we conduct the vaccine

1:10:02

vaccination campaign if we see typhoid persisting uh we'll be able to to have

1:10:08

evidence that vaccination alongside you know Environmental Management is is going to be a key to eliminating a

1:10:14

disease from the environment so I think what I got from what you said is that many diseases are complex problems that

1:10:21

cannot be tied down to a single shot solution so it's uh includes more parts

1:10:27

of the ecosystem to work together yeah and we also have to remember that so many of the most threatening diseases uh

1:10:34

these days are uh zoonotic uh infectious diseases diseases that transfer uh from

1:10:40

animals to humans um so if if that disease is spreading

1:10:46

Vector through different animals uh uh coronaviruses for example are a classic case of that

1:10:52

um you know Myrrh is coming from Camels um so what we need to establish is uh

1:11:00

preventative vaccines and and Animal Control uh uh and and animal

1:11:06

epidemiology detract the spreads of these um other uh infectious diseases that we

1:11:12

see prop up hemorrhagic fevers so right now there's a a Marburg fever outbreak uh in Africa uh I believe it was in uh

1:11:20

Gambia or the guinea Bissell where there's there's currently a spread of of Marburg and that can have an animal

1:11:25

Vector um we're looking at a uh a tick-borne hemorrhagic fever called severe fever

1:11:33

with thrombocytopenia and that's currently spread by a tick

1:11:39

um which of course Austria is famous for its ticks [Music] um and that that tick is currently isolated

1:11:45

in China and Japan and Korea but there's a threat that that tick will spread

1:11:52

um through trade and through climate change and that sfts will travel with it and this hemorrhagic fever has a 25

1:11:58

mortality rate um now we're looking at Hantz virus as well which is spread by by mice so

1:12:06

um I think we have to take a comprehensive approach uh we're looking at that now in AMR a one health approach

1:12:12

not just human health but Animal Health ivi doesn't work too much in Animal Health but I think the global Health

1:12:18

Community at large has to take a holistic approach to containing these diseases I mean vaccines is one part of

1:12:25

the equation to solve these problems uh the other parts then you have been protecting vulnerable populations and

1:12:32

also promoting socioeconomic development is ivi is totally focused on the vaccine

1:12:37

development part or do you also tap into the other parts to do we look more

1:12:43

development of the disease and how you can stop the disease from spreading so ivi focuses on on the vaccine and the

1:12:51

vaccine development but as part of our our developing evidence and demonstrating a need we conduct the the

1:12:59

economic studies and uh that that demonstrate the the economic value of

1:13:05

these diseases um so again that's showing the um the economic burden that these

1:13:11

diseases cause uh and the economic value that would come from developing and implementing these vaccines

1:13:20

but I think also I mean when when I look at the lower income countries we also

1:13:27

need a lot of development in the countries of the infrastructure who takes care of that is this on Ibis

1:13:33

Mission or is this uh still an open question mark you mentioned cholera before in typhoid yeah and so in since

1:13:41

it was Cincinnati that basically uh the vaccine alone vaccines alone didn't

1:13:46

solve the problem but uh you also had to work on the infrastructure who is doing

1:13:51

that on a global level so there are other partners who work on that we do a little bit of work on that

1:13:57

um on we do a little bit of wash training and exercises when we do vaccination efficacy studies and

1:14:03

campaigns we'll frequently provide wash training uh to the the populations uh

1:14:09

We've also in Madagascar not too long ago we helped address the spread of

1:14:14

schistosomiasis by improving access to clean water and toilets so we we built

1:14:20

some toilets in Madagascar and and uh and built some wells within communities

1:14:25

uh to protect them from exposure to schistosomiasis and the normal freshwater regions

1:14:31

is it sustainable I mean when you beat them how's the situation a few years later Palestine they aren't working or

1:14:38

what it needs some additional training capacity building is the term you used before right right so I mean it's it's

1:14:45

one thing to build something but then people have to maintain it um so that's when we build these things

1:14:50

we work with the locals to make sure that they have the the tools and the training and the the resources necessary

1:14:56

to not only build it themselves but then maintain it once the work is done so in ivia helped establish these facilities

1:15:03

in Madagascar it wasn't an ivi scientist doing the work it was an amalogassy worker from his community doing the work

1:15:10

yeah yeah that's great that's great to hear uh I mean this is also I think a problem of diplomacy then uh to bring

1:15:17

globality resources together what what how important is diplomas in your

1:15:22

opinion the soldier these problems so you know vaccine diplomacy uh I think

1:15:28

you can there's two types of vaccine diplomacy and and you can summarize it in the old adage of uh give someone a

1:15:36

fish or teach them to fish and it's the same with with the vaccine diplomacy so

1:15:42

the traditional model the the easy model uh if you're a policy maker or a government official or Diplomat is is to

1:15:49

give the fish um so it's to to contribute funding to uh to an international organization uh

1:15:57

so they can buy products on the downstream side and then just throw money at the problem

1:16:03

and and do a photo op and walk away happy um the harder part of teaching someone

1:16:08

to fish which you could characterize as vaccine science diplomacy as you can already tell from ivi's work it's it's a

1:16:15

lot more arduous it's a lot more dirty and Hands-On and it takes a lot more time and

1:16:21

with vaccine diplomacy the outcomes are usually pretty quick which is valuable

1:16:26

for for a pile politician uh who has to demonstrate you know value to his his uh

1:16:31

his voters or to his his bosses his boss you know he can you know donate money to

1:16:37

uh to Gabby or to Global funds and then say I did X amounts of this and it's

1:16:42

done but if it takes 10 years to develop a vaccine and that's you know two or

1:16:47

three election Cycles away and you've made no progress that's that's a much harder sell to the public and to the

1:16:53

ministries of Finance but how can we solve this problem and we need to to see it very often in Europe

1:16:59

like this analogy that you brought up it's either giving the fish and uh I think it is the podcast with checks

1:17:05

Canal who said uh once you have identified the problem throwing money at the problem is not always the right

1:17:10

solution uh and the other part is teaching to fish I mean when you look at Europe for example a serious problem uh

1:17:19

growing in the last two decades so I think the Public Funding for basic research uh is getting bigger and bigger

1:17:27

and bigger every year but then comes the bottleneck of private funding because Public Funding doesn't fund usually

1:17:32

clinical trials Public Funding doesn't uh fund Market access got Public Funding

1:17:38

usually except the pandemic doesn't fund also distribution of vaccines uh the

1:17:44

thing is that I see then a lot of uh Solutions sitting on the shelf that you mentioned before but not moving forward

1:17:50

how what can we do to come from the uh give the fish attitude or transition

1:17:57

from the gift of fish attitude more to wouldn't it be better to set the right

1:18:02

framework of regulations in place that help teaching people to fish part of that falls on our shoulders of

1:18:09

responsibility of showing that it it can be done showing that it's worked in the

1:18:15

past and that it's it's it's not impossible it's it is easy to get

1:18:21

into the system um there is a system in place the ivi approach for example of developing a

1:18:26

vaccine from evidence through licensure and delivery it's it's there it works it's a it's a proven model

1:18:33

um and so the the funders they have to expand their Horizons they have to expand what's possible through their

1:18:39

Grant mechanisms to facilitate these problems because what you've pointed out is is absorption capacity

1:18:46

um a good example of that uh is is African vaccine manufacturing uh so in

1:18:52

in the post-pandemic environment we've had uh five billion dollars donated uh

1:18:58

to Africa for vaccine manufacturing and another 10 billion promised for African vaccine manufacturer that's 15 billion

1:19:05

for African vaccine manufacturing and there's only 10 manufacturers in all of Africa

1:19:12

um so it's 1.5 degrees in each then exactly and then you have and then you

1:19:17

also have the lack of the regular three capacity and then you have limited clinical trial capacity you have very

1:19:23

limited basic research capacity so the problem is is that a lot of policy

1:19:29

makers get tunnel vision towards one easy solution it's like okay I'm going to put funding in African vaccine

1:19:35

manufacturing because that sounds good I'm going to put all the funding into basic research because that looks good

1:19:41

but if you're not taking the holistic comprehensive approach to the to the industry into the life cycle of a

1:19:47

vaccine as a product then again you're gonna you're not gonna have success you're going to have limited outcomes as

1:19:54

you mentioned I couldn't agree more I mean I understand the problem that you point out that the politician basically

1:19:59

a policymaker has a four year or five year cycle so he or she has to produce results uh

1:20:06

putting on the holistic classes means deciding on solutions that show first effects

1:20:14

probably in 10 or 15 years and not in 45 years when now the let's call it competition from another party uh

1:20:21

focuses more on short-term Solutions which for example building a plant I mean you see the

1:20:27

plant it's there it can be built in four years and it's something tangible uh so in the eye of the water probably the

1:20:34

party with the short-term solution which doesn't have a long-term effect on a holistic effect uh looks better than the

1:20:41

person who thinks holistically and puts the long-term solution in place do you have a an easy solution so it's a

1:20:50

problem not yet you know it's it's it's it's the million dollar question it's a work in progress isn't it it's yeah

1:20:57

that's up to us that's something that we have to do to to demonstrate that value

1:21:02

um there are certain countries there are certain partners and organizations in the world that see that value and have

1:21:07

funded towards it thus far um we can bring up the Gates Foundation or the welcome trust for example or

1:21:13

countries like uh historic funders of ivi like Sweden and Korea which see the

1:21:19

value in these long-term Cycles um I would ask you the same question you

1:21:25

know what do you think yeah how do we how do we improve the sales pitch towards towards the governments and the

1:21:30

policy makers it's a good question I was hoping that you have fiance I mean when I look at the problem I think it's a problem of democracies basically so this

1:21:38

disruptive when I think about the other political systems uh I mean you don't have to talk about it if you don't want

1:21:44

to just say and to be switched to another question I was just thinking I mean China has a different system uh Saudi Arabia has a different system in

1:21:51

place also some some African countries do you see also North Korea mentioned before do you see in such countries for

1:21:59

some uh decisions like uh long-term effects in vaccine development for

1:22:04

example do you see a possibility that they are more more likely to put on the

1:22:10

holistic long-term classes when they make decisions than democracies I think in democracy is really difficult

1:22:15

Uber is a very interesting question it's one that I think a lot of uh funding

1:22:21

recipients are reluctant to address for for fear of of hurting anybody's feelings or harming relations

1:22:27

um when when we look at our partners we don't consider so much you know a form

1:22:32

of government just as much as a commitment to Global health and domestic health and protecting populations that's

1:22:39

that's the key thing because when you look at countries that have different forms of governments they still have the

1:22:45

same priority of helping their people protecting their people growing their economies so it's it's feasible to develop a value

1:22:52

proposition and to show the efficacy of in making these long-term Investments

1:22:59

um but in those communities you also need uh an access to information to to clarify

1:23:06

um what the challenges are what the risks are and and what the potential solutions to those are you know if

1:23:12

you're in a in a government that's uh always on the positive side of things

1:23:18

always highlighting the positive things it's it's hard to do the SWOT analysis and to say well maybe you should do this

1:23:24

and this rather than just the one thing so I think it's it's a it's it's going to be a challenge across any kind of

1:23:31

governments yeah that's true I mean in my uneducated point of view when I look at the last three decades so I graduated

1:23:38

in the 90s and I think when I look at the kind of poverty for example and also

1:23:44

the technological advancement globally I believe uh one part of this advancement

1:23:51

was Global collaboration so as you mentioned that countries work together on solving problems that uh companies

1:23:59

work together with governments and solving problems and do that on a global basis I think the worst thing that can

1:24:06

happen to to our society or the human population on this planet is that we

1:24:12

fall back basically in the thinking like it was in 1800s that everybody starts seeing just their own country and stop

1:24:20

Global collaboration I think the solution is always uh bring people bring the experts together

1:24:25

uh clear with how do you see that when it comes to Global collaboration

1:24:32

um on that I think we're we've had quite a bit of success um I think ivi has

1:24:37

staff from 23 24 different nationalities and each of them provides their own

1:24:43

network of contacts across a number of different countries and we have programs in a wide variety of countries across

1:24:50

the world and there is an interest in in bridging that Gap you know we were talking about

1:24:55

vaccine science diplomacy um a great example uh we can bring up is

1:25:00

Albert Sabin and uh uh what was it Mikhail chernikoff the um Soviet

1:25:06

scientist who and they were behind the the global effort for oral polio vaccine

1:25:12

um so they they worked on that project at my alma mater University Cincinnati that's where they started it and while

1:25:19

the governments of the US and Soviet Union later promoted and celebrated the work of those scientists while they were

1:25:26

in the early stages of the process both the KGB and the FBI were actively trying to prevent it

1:25:31

um so we have this challenge of scientists across borders and countries want to

1:25:37

work together and see the value of working together in some circumstances we can do it with

1:25:43

the governments uh and circumstances we have to do it without them um and then we have to find the funding

1:25:49

resources elsewhere private sector philanthropy and and build our own path uh and if we can do that we can

1:25:56

demonstrate value uh which governments will then later invest in after the fact

1:26:01

I mean I'm coming from the business that I think finding the funding is might be

1:26:07

difficult without governments but it's possible I think what's impossible without governments is having laws in

1:26:14

place that uh allow people to work together instead of laws that prohibit Global collaboration and for example

1:26:22

when I run a company and they see a an expert sitting in the United States and the other expert in India and the next

1:26:27

experts in China and potentially you mentioned North Korea from the business perspective I would say okay I need to

1:26:32

pull these experts together to solve the problem so that we can move forward but sometimes regulations work in a

1:26:39

different direction um how how can ivi help to keep this

1:26:46

Global collaboration in the minds of politicians globally Global governments globally but what's what's your role in

1:26:52

that I think the the example that was demonstrated by Saban and chernikov on

1:26:59

the oral polio vaccine is is a really a key Benchmark that we can follow um luckily the vaccine development

1:27:05

programs that we've been able to complete uh with our partner countries through Tech transfers and and hosting

1:27:10

clinical trials as demonstrated that it's it's possible to work across borders

1:27:16

um to Share technology and it's not a uh a zero-sum game it's not a win-lose

1:27:23

situation it's a win-win situation um if if we are able to develop the

1:27:28

capacity for one country to manufacture vaccines and another to conduct basic

1:27:34

research in other to do clinical trials those three countries can work together to complete the development of vaccine

1:27:39

and it's been done uh and and we can do it again and again and again

1:27:44

um and the the end outcome um which of course you can measure through sustainable development goals is

1:27:51

uh a reduction in poverty among the popular relation which leads to economic

1:27:56

growth higher education attainments um there's a return on investment of

1:28:01

vaccines um I think it's what one dollar spent is like 16 returns

1:28:07

um the the evidence is there and and we can do it uh but I think it's the timeline that

1:28:13

that we really run into that it hurts the process here's the sales pitch that's always the

1:28:19

problem um calling it's great talking to you I have two questions left so one question is uh talking a little bit about your

1:28:26

expansion to Austria and the second question is about the future of Ibis Mission and uh your role in the

1:28:33

organization um before I ask these two questions did I miss anything in our recording is

1:28:39

there something that you would like to address uh or a question you would like me to ask I think we've we've covered a lot of the

1:28:46

the material on on what ivi is doing globally and and I hope I've been able to answer some questions about what ivi

1:28:53

is and what a role are and what our role is and how we're different from other organizations in the fields uh I'm I

1:29:00

know we have a couple participants online I'm fine to take questions but um I think so anyway

1:29:06

um but at any rate um I'll be happy to to talk about ivi's work in Europe and Austria these days

1:29:13

sure um so uh as part of ivi's new strategy um we realized that we had to get out of

1:29:20

our comfort zone um you know for the last 20 25 years our headquarters has been in South Korea uh

1:29:27

which has had plenty of benefits and advantages but the disadvantages uh are

1:29:33

also worth noting uh most of our work these days takes place in Africa so there is a an eight-hour time zone

1:29:40

difference between Korea and and the time zones in Africa which makes it very difficult to coordinate meetings uh you

1:29:47

lose time on getting agreements completed and and data sharing and discussion

1:29:53

um also a lot of the global Health decision making takes place in Europe um and Brussels and Geneva and to a

1:30:00

degree in Vienna as well London so um by by putting IV an ivi office in Europe

1:30:07

um a couple good things come out first of all uh our researchers are able to work more effectively with with Partners

1:30:13

in Africa as well as the Middle East something we're looking at and then we're also able to get a seat

1:30:19

at the table we're able to get uh into the the World Health assembly and and work with uh uh philanthropic

1:30:27

organizations who have small meetings on the sidelines and and you know across Europe uh we're also able to get access

1:30:34

to the EU Horizons and edcdp funding uh to help expand our work uh and there's a

1:30:40

great network of uh European biotech there's there's plenty of potential capacity

1:30:46

um available to work with so a couple years ago ivi hosted a competition to

1:30:51

host a call for proposal to host an office in Europe and we received uh

1:30:56

three finalists there was Austria Sweden and France and all the proposals were

1:31:03

very generous um but because Sweden was one of the founding members of ivi our board

1:31:09

decided to put the office in Sweden um that being said

1:31:14

um the offer that we received from Austria was incredibly generous and very interesting and so we went back to

1:31:20

Austria and said you know what do you think about us establishing a smaller office to establish those same goals

1:31:26

that objectives we had previously discussed uh would Austria still be interested in hosting ivi and the answer

1:31:33

was resoundingly yes uh and so last year we quickly went through the process of setting up the

1:31:39

plan to host this office here and in terms of of what we're doing here in Austria

1:31:44

um so we just finished the seed agreement sign so we're now we're fully established the Austrian government is

1:31:50

now exploring membership and ivi potentially joining as a member State uh later this year

1:31:55

and now we're here to offer cooperation opportunities with Austrian research

1:32:00

institutes and companies um you know we have the potential to advance uh the introduction of Austrian

1:32:07

biotech and vaccine Innovations into use for Global Public Health um you know there's potential to for us

1:32:14

you know ivi and Austrian Partners to develop consortiums uh you know centered on vaccine r d uh joint Grant

1:32:21

application uh training and capacity building programs um there's a lot of potential uh in the

1:32:28

country and region uh that we want to explore and work out uh what we can do

1:32:33

together so basically just plant example so for example if there would be a if there was

1:32:40

a company developing a new formulation so that vaccines become orally available that before we weren't already available

1:32:47

um could they approach you uh asking you for trying to research for collaboration for their research forward

1:32:55

that's right yeah so if if there is in in Austria or elsewhere if there is a research institute or a biotech firm who

1:33:02

thinks that they have a promising vaccine candidate or Associated technology uh we invite them to contact

1:33:07

us and approach us and uh and we can see if there's potential to work together

1:33:13

then let's come to the final question uh Ibis future uh how to how to use the

1:33:20

global Affairs manager at FBI how to see the future of uh your institution in

1:33:25

2010 in the next 10 20 30 years that's a good question

1:33:32

um so my goal AS Global Affairs manager is is to manage our diplomatic relations

1:33:37

with our member states and so so my commission my objective is to get as

1:33:42

many countries as possible to join IBI and uh so my mission over the next five

1:33:48

ten years however long it be is to to demonstrate and communicate ivi's value

1:33:53

uh to potential partner countries um the value that ivi presents it's it's

1:33:59

Unique its unique role and capacity for developing vaccines uh and and to

1:34:05

facilitate the growth opportunities for local biotech companies the ability to achieve uh progress in sustainable

1:34:11

development goals um and address infectious diseases that uh are an emerging problem with climate

1:34:19

change with AMR that presents uh an a heavy burden on on the health of women

1:34:26

and children and affect brutality rates uh ivi is able to make a great impact

1:34:32

and through Partnerships with ivi countries can also make a great impact uh in global health

1:34:39

um so in the next year so this year starting in October um ivi is establishing a global Council

1:34:45

uh so ivi is evolving more towards its role as an international organization so

1:34:50

from October I think 19 we'll be hosting our inaugural Global council meeting in which all of our member states will come

1:34:57

together and and begin advising ivi and its strategy and Direction and how we can be of service to individual

1:35:03

countries and Global Health as a whole that sounds that sounds good the science

1:35:10

fiction question I still have for the for the end to you do you do you see the possibility to a one fixes all diseases

1:35:18

vaccine basically that's uh I mean mRNA it was always hoping mRNA that it can be

1:35:24

really used for uh covering a lot of topics with one vaccine

1:35:30

um what do you see on the technology side for the future uh in your area but

1:35:35

as a global Affairs manager note that you're more of the Diplomatic side but before you see in the daily work do you

1:35:41

see any breakthrough technology in the pipeline where you can say okay I mean it might not fix all problems we have

1:35:47

with viruses but uh there is potential that we can fix globally for for for the

1:35:54

entire human race the majority of problems that's that's the goal of ivi and ultimately the goal is to shut down

1:36:00

ivi by eliminating all these infectious diseases to close up the shop and move on to something else

1:36:07

um I think we're a long way away from that um there are so many interesting Technologies coming up we have of course

1:36:13

the MRNA technology in terms of Technology innovations that ivi focuses on uh we're

1:36:20

looking at things like uh encapsulation vaccines in pill form which of course address issues with with temperature

1:36:27

control uh looking at vaccine patches patch you know a patch that you stick on

1:36:32

your arm to apply a vaccine which also deals with delivery and and temperature and cost issues

1:36:38

um I'm a fan of sci-fi as well and and I wonder if we're gonna see future

1:36:44

developments in in crispr or Gene editing that we'll be able to confer

1:36:49

natural levels of immunity uh will we be able to to modify or edit the immune

1:36:55

system so that it's automatically protected uh against all forms of infectious diseases

1:37:02

um but then I but then I also wonder at in a classic scientific uh or a science

1:37:07

fiction level is what's the double edge of the sword you know if if we're somehow able to prevent all

1:37:14

infectious diseases do we then in turn lose something does that create its own problem in some respects

1:37:21

um you know we might as as we involve evolve in technological development we

1:37:26

might find that viruses and bacteria can be edited as drug delivery uh you know

1:37:32

Nanobots for example and you know have a have a valuable potential for some future health use and uh

1:37:39

so my I I am hopeful I'm optimistic and I'm

1:37:44

a Believer in the capacity of Science and Technology to solve our problems but

1:37:49

with any problem that we've solved new problems always emerge so that's that's an interesting point that you brought up

1:37:56

instead of fighting against bacteria and viruses make use of it yeah yeah and

1:38:03

there's some work being done in that you know in terms of Cancer Treatments yeah using you know converted viruses or

1:38:09

bacteria so I think the sky's the limit in that area of technology and maybe Nanobots maybe maybe a nanobot that can

1:38:17

just kill viruses and bacteria that's the way to go something right and now let me ask you the final question what's

1:38:24

your personal goal in the next 10 years what do you want to achieve I think in the next 10 years uh I want

1:38:31

to be able to say that I helped ivi grow from a sleepy not really well-known Research

1:38:37

Institute into a globally recognized frequently called upon international

1:38:42

organization that is able to develop and deliver Solutions uh for the world and

1:38:48

Global Health that will continue to develop more vaccines vaccine timelines

1:38:53

are long but maybe we can get another two vaccines out in my time at ivi and uh and really make a difference in

1:39:00

saving people's lives because that's ultimately the goal that's why we're here it's what we're doing it there's no point that that people should

1:39:07

be dying of vaccine preventable diseases um there's so much you know opportunity

1:39:13

there's so much you know human wealth out there in the world that that we're losing out you know it's the old question of you know how many potential

1:39:19

Einsteins died as illiterate peasants in the field because they never reach their full opportunity and how much value

1:39:26

could those people deliver to the world and I see the same thing with uh with vaccines you know we can

1:39:33

facilitate the arrival of more Einsteins by protecting their health that's a great Mission that's a great

1:39:39

vision I love what you say and from what I learned in the last three years is uh

1:39:44

make use of social media make use of podcasts it really helps these days to spread your message and you have a

1:39:51

fantastic message and a fantastic Mission thank you for sharing it on my podcast thank you very much Christian

1:39:57

it's a pleasure and I'm happy to talk to you anytime in the future thank you for having you today here on

1:40:02

the podcast uh all the best to you and your team and keep on fighting against viruses and bring people together to

1:40:09

solve our problems thank you very much looking forward to it thank you have a great day bye see ya bye-bye

1:40:16

so thank you for listening and as we wrap up today's episode with Colleen

1:40:22

McCann we've explored how collaboration and Innovative approaches can unlock the

1:40:28

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1:41:04

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